Elize Matsunaga: Once Upon a Crime (2021) s01e04 Episode Script
Echoes of a Crime
[tense music builds]
LAST DAY OF TRIAL
[reporter 1] Elize Matsunaga's trial
is almost over
[reporter 2] After seven days of trial,
it's considered one of the longest
in the history of São Paulo.
[Elize Matsunaga]
I knew there would be reporters there,
but I didn't think
there would be that many.
This line at Barra Funda Criminal Court
is made up of people who want to follow
I even asked myself, "Why?"
"Why are they so interested?"
[reporter 3] What sentence
does she deserve for killing her husband
[reporter 4]
Elize killed her husband for money.
[reporter 5]
She used to be a luxury escort
[reporter 6] One of the most
famous murderers in the country.
[Paula] This one reporter said,
"Wow, this is the last famous crime
going to trial."
She said, "Well, we need to make
another crime a big hit now."
I felt like
that is the power of the press.
It's a notorious crime.
In a way,
we're the ones who made it famous.
[dramatic music playing]
[Thaís] After all,
who is Elize Matsunaga?
To answer that question,
we went to her hometown.
Chopinzinho is located
in southwestern Paraná,
250 miles from the capital.
I went to Chopinzinho
just before the trial.
The arrival of a TV crew
with all that equipment,
cameras, microphone,
drew attention.
At first, my strategy
was talking to people
who were connected to Elize,
but not part of her family.
CHOPINZINHO
COUNTRYSIDE OF PARANÁ
[woman] I knew her mom,
but I didn't know she was her mother.
She'd never mentioned it.
But the driver told me. He said,
"She is the mother of that woman
who killed her husband in São Paulo."
And she showed up.
And when I saw her, I thought,
"Wow, her mom is really dark-skinned."
And she was a person that
She looked so pretty, her eyes
[woman 2] I used to work with her sister
over in the hospital.
All I remember is seeing the footage
of her taking the bags to the
What is it called? The
I forgot what it's called.
Oh, yeah, to the elevator.
Yeah, that's when we saw she killed him
and dismembered him.
That was it.
[interviewer]
Did people talk about it here?
Yes. Yes, they did.
Because she was born here.
- People talked a lot. A lot.
- [dog whines]
What if he threatened her
or did something to her?
She'd have to defend herself.
There's that, too.
When they heard about Chopinzinho,
people thought
of the Elize Matsunaga case,
the woman who chopped up the Yoki guy.
[Elize] It's a really small town.
It's inevitable that people talk
and point fingers.
Seeing my family in that situation,
running away from reporters
I remember my sister had to leave work
through the back door.
[Thaís] Visiting the house
where Elize grew up
was the last thing I did.
And I think reporters develop
some kind of instinct.
We came here
looking for Elize Matsunaga's relatives.
They used to live here, right?
[man] They did, but not anymore.
[Thaís] Not even her sister, uncle
No?
This man says he doesn't know her
but he's actually her stepfather.
He dodges the questions and seems to be
uncomfortable with the subject.
Do you happen to know
where her family is living now?
No, ma'am. I don't know
where they're living now.
[Thaís] I don't know
if it was the way he looked at me,
or the way he behaved,
but something was weird.
I called Elize's lawyer and asked him,
"Luciano, is there something
about the relationship
between Elize and her stepfather
that might be important to this case?"
And then he told me about it
under the condition that I didn't publish
anything about it at that moment,
because he intended
to reveal that in court.
[camera shutters clicking]
[suspenseful music playing]
[Luciano] My strategy in court
was to show the jury who Elize was.
I wanted it to be as long as possible
to drive the jury away
from the image they'd seen on TV.
[D'Urso] When there is a repercussion
on a lawsuit
that is widely publicized in advance,
the jury already had information
they'd gotten way before.
[gavel banging]
That is to say,
I need to humanize Elize for the jury.
[judge] Tell me this,
what is your hometown?
- Chopinzinho.
- State?
Paraná.
And your life there
modest, rich? Financially speaking.
My life was modest.
[Luciano] Elize went through
ups and downs.
And I wanted to show them her life
has never been a straight line. Never.
[judge] Did you live with your parents?
When my dad left my mom,
I moved in with my grandparents.
[Luciano] What did I need
to show the jury?
That her father abandoned her
when she was three.
Her mom had to leave town
to find a job as a housekeeper
in the capital.
When her mom comes back,
she's with her stepfather.
Her stepfather moves in.
She is no longer under the care
of her grandparents or her aunt.
THE '90s
[Elize] What I went through
with my stepfather,
I don't wish that on any woman.
I don't wish that on any person.
And I also have a sister.
She is his daughter.
I think she went through
some really tough situations.
This story coming to the surface,
emerging like that
[crying] It's still too hard for me
to talk about it.
[interviewer] Was it inside your house?
Yes.
[somber music playing]
[barking]
These things
they don't happen out of the blue.
Some situations come up
and we don't even notice them.
I remember one day it caught my attention
that he changed the bathroom lock.
He did it in such a way that
we couldn't lock the door from the inside.
So, I'd go to the bathroom
and I couldn't lock the door.
I had to keep the door unlocked.
Often, when I had
just gotten into the bathroom,
he'd open the door and say,
"Oh, I'm sorry.
I didn't know you were in there."
One day, I was showering
I was 15.
There was a tilting window
a small window in the bathroom.
There was a tree outside,
and I saw him looking at me.
I looked out the window and said,
"Who's there?"
At the time
I didn't even notice it was him
and I left running,
wrapped the towel around me, and
Then he came
and he grabbed me.
[somber music intensifies]
[judge] Did Elize suffer
any sexual violence?
I've always been suspicious.
She only confirmed it years later.
Who was it?
Her stepfather.
[Thaís] Elize's case
is not an isolated fact.
Every hour,
three children or teenagers
are sexually abused in Brazil.
In 75% of the cases, the offender
is a member of the child's family.
[water running]
[Elize] I wanted to rub my skin
until it bled.
And I thought I was the one to blame.
I'd look at myself
and feel ashamed of being a woman.
I was angry at God.
[Elize's lawyer] She didn't have anyone
to vent about what she was going through.
So, she kept holding that feeling
inside of her
and experiencing all that
that pain, that anguish.
[Elize] On that day,
I can't remember exactly what I did then.
I was desperate.
But I managed to get away from him.
And I ran.
I ran and I ran and I didn't
even know where I was going.
I just grabbed the towel and ran away.
After that day, I decided to leave.
I decided to run away from home.
I put some things in my backpack,
grabbed a knife,
as if I'd be able to defend myself
from the world.
I went to my godmother
and borrowed 50 bucks from her.
My intention was to go out into the world.
I remember
while I was walking along the road
[sniffles] with no destination,
not knowing where I'd go
a car was following me.
I was so
oblivious as to what
was going on around me,
I didn't even notice it.
And then the guy started talking to me,
"Hey, lady. Where are you going?"
And that woke me up.
As if I had woken up from a dream.
So I started running.
I started running and running.
I didn't know where to go.
It's so agonizing to keep running
while not knowing where to go.
I just knew I had to run.
I got into the bushes.
I
That seemed like
a good hiding place to me.
Like an animal escaping from something,
searching for a den.
I was there behind the bushes.
I don't know for how long
or for how many hours.
I remember I slept.
The next day,
I didn't know what to do.
I was lost and even afraid of leaving.
I smelled food.
Then I saw a man on a horse.
He told me his house was just ahead.
He showed me
he pointed to me where his house was.
It was a beautiful house
in the middle of the woods,
in the middle of a huge forest.
His house was beautiful.
So, I went there. I ate,
I slept.
The next day,
he called Child Protective Services.
I couldn't say anything. I didn't
[buzzing]
I was scared to go back home.
I was scared no one would believe me.
[keyboard clacking]
I kept silent.
I didn't say my name.
I even lied about my name, actually.
Forty-five days passed
before I went back home.
[Elize's aunt] Everyone was desperate
around here.
Us here at home, my sister
Everyone was desperately looking for her
calling Child Protective Services,
the police.
Then they eventually found her,
so my sister and I went to get her.
Then I went back home.
It was hard
because I didn't want to go back,
but I had nowhere else to go.
That changed me so much.
Maybe if that hadn't happened,
I wouldn't have been so desperate
to leave that place.
That's when she moves to her aunt's.
Rosie's.
She's the one person who's always been
by Elize's side the whole time.
[interviewer] Did she tell you why
she wanted to stay with you
and not her mother or her sister?
No.
She just said she
she didn't want to stay there.
So, I asked my sister
if she could stay with me.
I told her to leave her with me.
[Elize] I grew up without my father.
And that absence,
that bad feeling,
I didn't want my daughter
to feel that.
That had a lot of influence
on me trying to maintain my marriage.
Even when it wasn't so good.
Especially after I found out
about his first affair,
and after I found out about my pregnancy
when I'd already decided to get a divorce.
But it really influenced me.
I wanted my daughter to have a father,
unlike myself.
[judge] If you didn't want your daughter
to go through the same as you did,
not having a father,
then why did you kill him?
And what will you tell her
when you have the opportunity
to tell her you killed
and chopped up her father?
What was the reason?
I'll ask her for forgiveness.
I'll ask for forgiveness
and I'll tell her what happened
when the time is right.
She's just a child now.
- [prosecutor] Can I dismiss the witness?
- [judge] Yes, you can.
Any further questions,
members of the jury? No?
Okay.
I'm positive
Elize suffered emotional abuse.
She suffered psychological violence.
It was obvious
she suffered emotional abuse.
There was no dialogue between them.
There was, in fact,
an attempt on his part to subdue her.
The offender tries to instill false ideas
in the victim's mind.
Just like in parental alienation,
in which the spouse or the parent
also tries to instill false,
derogatory ideas
inside the child's mind.
That she was the one to blame
for that bad situation.
Based on what I know
about toxic relationships
by talking to victims,
and by my own experience,
when it comes to abusive relationships,
in 85% of cases,
the offenders are male.
It's not necessarily
about physical violence.
It's also about psychological violence,
verbal abuse.
[D'Urso] I think that
if this happens to someone,
no matter how bad it is,
separation is the solution.
As a matter of fact,
separation is what the law provides.
No one can be forced
to stay in a relationship.
I remember I started by saying,
"Marcos made a mistake, a huge mistake."
All right? But that doesn't justify
what happened to him in the end.
[D'Urso] Nothing justifies homicide.
Nothing.
And, unfortunately,
that was the path Elize chose.
LAST DAY OF TRIAL
[reporter 1] Elize might leave the court
through the front door
and even be acquitted.
How likely is that to happen?
Well, that can only be decided by the jury
based on their analyses.
Four women and three men
[reporter 2]will decide
Elize Matsunaga's sentence.
[reporter 3] Jurors have been gathered
for over two and a half hours.
The judge asked them to meet at 11:00 p.m.
Expectations are high.
[Juliana] I don't know if you've ever seen
how the voting works.
Each member gets a card
that says "yes" or "no."
Like a deck of cards.
The criteria are written beforehand.
The judge asks the questions,
and the jury members
cast their "yes" or "no" votes.
[Luciano] It's different from the U.S.
here in Brazil.
In the U.S., they have
a lot of information on the jurors.
We had very little information about them.
We knew their names and their jobs.
That's next to nothing.
They're not familiar
with the Criminal Code,
so, they're there to be convinced.
[Juliana] The judge then opens the bag,
counts the votes,
and, finally, writes down the results.
All of those answers
will define if that individual
who is being judged
is guilty or innocent.
If they are innocent,
then the matter is settled.
If they are guilty, the judge will then
need to establish the sentence.
When you go to the secret room
and the first item is voted,
which is authorship and concreteness,
no one, not a single soul,
will be able to contain the adrenaline
from going up.
The heart goes thud, thud, thud.
[tense music playing]
I remember that at a certain point
everyone had to leave the room.
And we spent a lot of time
in the reporters' room,
talking, sharing whatever food was left.
Because we were there for several hours.
It was too late to order a pizza.
It was almost 2:00 a.m.
[reporter] Right now, attention, please.
The courtroom doors have been opened,
and Elize Matsunaga's sentence
will be revealed
any time now.
Those minutes and seconds,
they were endless.
It seemed like it took longer
than the eight days I spent there.
I was very anxious.
A tremendous amount of anxiety.
In that single moment,
they'd decide my whole life.
Elize Araújo Kitano Matsunaga.
Please.
[unsettling music playing]
I was always sitting in the front row
with a panoramic view
of all the characters.
[D'Urso] Deep down, I was quite sure
that she would be convicted.
Let me tell you something.
I've never been afraid of the courtroom.
[Paula] Before the sentence,
he talked about the aggravators,
the votes of the jury
and what they understood.
[imperceptible]
And as the judge spoke,
it became clear
that two of the aggravators
weren't accepted by the jury.
"The sentence council recognizes
that of all aggravators,
there are enough consistent resources
to confirm
only the obstruction
of the victim's defense."
"It still recognized the materiality
and the authorship
of the crime
of mutilating and concealing a body."
[D'Urso] She had been accused
of committing third-degree murder
with foul motive and cruelty,
along with the impossibility
of the victim's defense.
The jury did not recognize all of that.
They only recognized the situation
that obstructed the victim's defense.
[reporter] The jury decided she did not
commit murder with foul motive,
and that her means were not cruel
since Marcos wasn't alive
when he was dismembered.
The defense was already celebrating,
almost jumping for joy for having
Well, it was definitely
a victory for them.
Her happiness
was a great moment of satisfaction for us.
- She was crying, right?
- She was crying.
[Luciano] Yeah, she was really crying.
[Paula] The defense was celebrating,
and the prosecution was outraged.
But when they heard the sentence,
everything immediately changed.
The final sentence
is established by the judge.
"have agreed on this,
on the sum of all sentences"
Our goal was to get her
a 30-year sentence,
which is the maximum penalty.
"with a total of 19 years, 11 months
and one day in prison."
[tense music playing]
Her sentence was basically 20 years.
The judge gave her
the longest sentence he could give her,
considering that two of the aggravators
weren't recognized.
[gavel banging]
[Thaís] No one was pleased.
One side wanted her
to leave through the front door,
and the other,
wanted her to get the maximum penalty.
The sentence applied by the judge
did not reflect the jury's decision.
He increased the sentence way too much.
There was no need for that at all.
That was not what the jury intended.
If you look at it as a game,
the defense definitely won.
It's undeniable.
It's undeniable
that the defense won the case.
If getting
Was it 19, almost 20 years, right?
If that is really a victory,
imagine what defeat would look like.
I don't think I won the case
because I wanted the aggravators.
What happened
was a brutal mistake of the jury.
I don't think the jury
is about winning or losing.
Otherwise, it'd be something personal.
The one being judged
is neither the defense,
nor the prosecution.
I asked the family
if they were interested in appealing
to increase the sentence.
And the family's position
was that justice had been served.
[judge] "Sentence signed in courtroom 10,
at 2:08 a.m., on December 5th, 2016,
by Adilson Paukoski Simoni,
presiding judge."
Have a good night.
Court is adjourned.
[interviewer] When the judge said,
"19 years," how did you feel?
Wow
I could just feel
and imagine and do the math of
how long it would take for me
to see my daughter.
How long and how many days
I would have to stay there
to finally see her again.
[somber music playing]
[Elize] Prison is hell.
There are things that
only a cell can do to you.
I've had to share a cell with one person,
with six other people,
with eight other people.
And I've had to share a cell
with 18 other people.
People there are living in survival mode.
[Thaís] We also need to know
who those inmates are.
Three out of ten of those inmates
didn't even go to trial.
We're talking about men and women
who are already in jail
without the law having decided
whether they're guilty or innocent.
For the most part, people in jail
are poor and Black
who are trafficking
small amounts of drugs.
So, Elize was an outlier there.
The dilemma of humanity
is how we should punish.
In the beginning,
there were death sentences.
At a certain point in history,
humanity found out
that by killing a convicted person,
their workforce would also die.
So when we look at the history
of the evolution
of the punishment sentences,
it's basically all about
the discovery of the fact
that instead of killing a convicted person
to punish them,
they could be punished
by keeping them alive and working.
That happened with the influence
of the Catholic Church,
which had in its monasteries,
places where individuals
who had violated the law
had to stay and pray.
And that area within the monastery
was called "penitentiary"
where there were cells
to pay the penances.
[sewing machine whirring]
[Elize] I learned how to sew there.
I learned how to manufacture pants,
for instance, shirts.
That allowed me to leave my cell
and go to a place where
where I was doing something.
I was working.
I was being helpful in some way.
[cell door opens]
[cell door closes]
[somber music playing]
[reverend] I went to visit her only once.
[reporter] Did Elize cry?
She did.
And she'd cry a lot
when she talked about her daughter.
[Elize] When she was born,
she was so fragile.
[sobs]
So tiny.
I wanted to put her in a bubble, you know?
By irony of fate,
I burst that bubble myself.
I have a spiritual bond with her.
I know I'll see her again.
I pray for that to happen.
It won't be easy
but that's my next goal.
FURLOUGH
I want to go back to having
a low-key life,
like I used to have.
Like I enjoyed having.
[rain pattering]
Without bothering people,
causing a fuss,
or annoying people.
Just living my life.
I'm so happy I'm going to see her.
I'm really happy.
I can hardly believe it.
[interviewer] How long has it been
since you've seen your grandmother?
Seven years.
It's been seven years, six months
and 20 days.
I haven't seen my grandmother
since I was arrested.
She's 86. It's hard for her.
It's really complicated to get around
and it's too far away from their place.
I made her a gift.
I sewed a tablecloth with daisies.
It's so her.
I hope she likes it.
[reporter] Elize Matsunaga left prison
for the first time
since her arrest for murdering
[reporter 2] Elize won't be able
to see her daughter.
[reporter 3] It's absurd
that these inmates get to leave.
Going to jail for serious crimes in Brazil
is like winning a prize.
They all look strong,
with their nails done.
Look, they're smiling.
It's the law, it's written.
But the people don't like it.
[reporter 4] Since inmates
aren't monitored in any way,
temporary releases spread thousands
of criminals through the streets.
Temporary releases are, in fact,
a temptation to escape,
an invitation for crime,
and an open door to chaos.
[Juliana] They're really about
resocialization.
Inmates who behave well
and meet certain requisites
demanded by the national prison law
have the right to temporarily leave
in certain
It's five times a year.
It lasts about five or six days on average
depending on the holiday.
In layman's terms, it may be frowned upon,
"Oh, the criminal
is out in the streets." But no.
The sentence is not eternal.
The person has been judged
and resocialization is part
of this instrument we call the "sentence,"
so the person can come back to society.
A person who has been sentenced to jail
has to gradually adapt to freedom
under the control of the State,
so they have better chances of leading,
from then on,
a life without risks
of committing more crimes.
It's a fact that Elize has rights.
That's a right the law has given her.
The law allows her that.
It's awful. I think it's awful.
If she committed a crime in 2012,
and then she's already out on the streets
in 2019,
she served time for around seven years
for killing someone.
I can't be the judge of that, you know?
The people can be the judge and decide
if that's really necessary.
[Figueira] I even heard
she was about to be released.
In the process of being released.
I think that's what the grandparents
are concerned about.
That this could create some fuss
with the daughter.
[Elize] Being able to leave for some days
and getting to solve a few things
is really significant to me.
It's really important.
I need to take these steps.
[Juliana] She used her release
to organize her life,
to take steps towards her future,
to be able to see her daughter again.
Elize has this clarity and consciousness
about what she wants.
She wants to, and she will be able
to rebuild an affectionate bond
with her daughter again. Little by little.
So I'm working and I'm putting effort
into providing that opportunity for her.
And she deserves that.
Nowadays, Elize,
she has had her parental rights
over her daughter suspended.
That means that during this period,
she can't demand to visit her.
This was right after the crime,
right after she got arrested.
It was a different scenario back in 2012.
There hadn't been a trial yet.
We weren't sure about
what would be decided.
[indistinct chatter]
[Juliana] Now that she's almost done,
I'll ask them to revoke it,
so that she can legally,
and under supervision,
see her daughter for a few hours.
[chatter continues]
[interviewer] Do you think her daughter
knows about Elize?
She does.
Elize's father-in-law said
she has known about the crime
and about her mother
for a year and a half.
[interviewer] What if Elize says
her goal now
is to have the right to have
custody of her daughter
or at least see her?
I can't talk about that
because of the attorney-client privilege.
The only thing I can say
is that the family's priority
is to protect the daughter.
This child's lost her mom
when she was arrested,
and she's lost her dad
because he was murdered,
and at such a tender age,
she has to deal with this tragedy
that has been imposed on her.
What the family is doing,
and has been doing since the beginning
YOKI CASE: EXECUTIVE IS BURIED
is preparing their granddaughter
for when she learns about it
in the future.
[Flávio] All of their interest,
all their emotional reactions
were directed at the grandchild
who became the focus of attention.
[somber music playing]
It's a stigma they'll carry for life.
It doesn't end with the pain of death.
It's something that has terrible
consequences that linger, you know.
What we feel as friends is just a fraction
of what his daughters will feel
having to grow up explaining that story.
They'll have to tell that story
when they go to school,
when they go to college,
when they get a boyfriend,
when they get married.
They'll have to explain it
to their children and grandchildren.
So they will never be done explaining it.
It'll keep echoing forever.
[somber music playing]
[Elize] I don't know
what the future holds for us.
I don't know if someday
I'll be able to meet her again.
I hope I will.
I pray to God for it.
I pray to Mary for it
because she's a mother too.
[church bells tolling]
I'd like to tell my daughter that
not even a day goes by
that I don't feel guilty about what I did.
And I pray that she
manages to overcome that.
If she can't forgive me,
that's fine. I will respect her.
[solemn music playing]
Something very curious happened to me.
I was in jail,
and I was fortunate enough
to dream about her
the whole night.
I didn't dream about her
as a baby.
I dreamed about her
as how she'd be right now.
With this long
black hair,
just like her father's.
[chuckles softly] Almond-shaped eyes.
She was laughing a lot.
She was
she was about this tall, give or take.
I've never felt more peaceful in my life
than in the moments
when I was holding her in my arms.
I'd look at her
The mental picture I have of her
is still like that.
I don't know what she looks like now.
[melancholy music playing]
My life right now
is like the stories
mothers tell their kids to scare them.
This girl that worked with me,
she was very young.
She was arrested when she was 18.
And she used to tell me,
"You know, Elize,
there was this man in my hometown
who was in jail for 10 years.
I would cross the street
whenever I saw him
because I was scared.
Will people do that to us as well?
Once we're back home,
will people do that when they see us?"
[interviewer] Are you afraid
of what might happen
when you go back to Chopinzinho?
I'm not going back there.
I chose to go to a nearby city.
I'm gonna see my grandma.
I don't even know what will happen
because
I talked to her on the phone yesterday,
and she told me she had back pains
and it was rough.
Moving around is so hard for her,
you know?
But I'm happy I'm going there.
No, no. I'm I'm here.
I'm already here.
Yeah, 301.
Just bring what's important.
Stuff you couldn't leave in the car.
I really admire my grandmother.
She was the one who took care
of me and my sister,
and she's faced a lot of hardships
in her life.
I want to hug her again.
That's as important to me
as being able to hug my daughter.
[Elize crying]
Oh, my God. Don't cry, honey.
These are tears of joy, Granny.
I know. I cannot cry
because I took so many prescribed meds
that I can't cry anymore,
even if my heart bursts.
- I know they're tears of joy.
- They're tears of joy, Granny,
not sadness.
Oh, I'm so glad God allowed us to meet.
God is wonderful.
You look so beautiful, Granny.
Thank you. Do you think so?
Yes, you look amazing.
You're so, so beautiful, Granny.
- You look beautiful too.
- Are you okay?
- Yes, thank God.
- What about your back?
And your legs? Come on, let's take a seat.
Oh, goodness. You look so pretty.
Oh, come on.
[gentle music playing]
[crying] And I'll always love you.
Always. Always.
I was so scared
I wouldn't be able to see you again.
But God allowed us to meet.
[Elize] All these years I prayed that
I could meet her once more.
[sobs] That I could tell her
from the bottom of my heart,
"Your granddaughter
is right here, Granny."
I made you something. I hope you like it.
[laughs softly]
It's a tablecloth.
I embroidered it.
You did this yourself?
[Maria Sebastiana]
She made a mistake, a big mistake.
She's paying a high price for her mistake.
But what I think hurts her the most
is her daughter.
That's the highest price she's paying.
I hope one day her daughter understands it
and forgives her.
That she'll listen to her version,
read the letters she wrote her,
the things she made for her.
I'd like to be able to show her
all that someday.
- Let me give you a hug.
- How are you?
- Oh, my God.
- I wish you all the best.
May God and your guardian angels
be with you always.
I always want to see you happy and pretty
like you are now.
Very pretty, okay?
Don't cry. God is with you.
- God and the guardian angels, always.
- Amen. Amen. Amen.
[crying] And they'll be with you too.
Thank you, Granny.
[Cosenzo] She's already lost
her parental rights.
What she can get back
is her daughter's love.
Love doesn't need bonds, documents,
determinations of codes
or anything like that.
It'll depend on her.
[D'Urso] I believe
that justice was served.
As for her sentence,
she will take it up with the State
and will do her time.
And what she'll do with her life later on,
that only concerns her and God.
[Elize] There's no way
I could just pretend that
the past doesn't exist.
What I can do now,
is try to live with the past
in the best way that I can.
I didn't think things would have escalated
to the extent that they have.
And I still can't understand
why people are so curious about it.
Just imagine if Elize were
were a cleaning lady
If Marcos Matsunaga were Black and poor.
would it have gotten
all the attention it did?
Of course not.
And why?
[Thaís] The crime Elize has committed
against Marcos,
we usually see that on TV
with the characters reversed.
A man who kills his wife
because he couldn't accept
the end of their relationship.
[soft music playing]
[interviewer sighs]
[interviewer] Is there anything else
you'd like to say
before we finish the interview?
Uh
The types of crimes
I learned about in prison
There are
crimes that are way more barbaric
than mine,
way more shocking than mine,
but nobody mentions them.
Nobody talks about them,
because the victim wasn't wealthy.
The victim was an ordinary person.
Someone poor.
If it had been the opposite, for example,
if I had lost my life in this situation,
not Marcos,
would he be here talking about it?
Would there be spotlights on him
and people eager to know,
"What about the victim, Elize?"
Who would I be?
[somber music playing]
TREMEMBÉ I WOMAN'S PENITENTIARY
ST. MARIA EUFRÁSIA PELLETIER
[dark version of Beethoven's
"Bagatelle No. 25 (Für Elise)" playing]
IF YOU OR SOMEONE YOU KNOW
SUFFERS FROM VIOLENCE OR ABUSE,
AND NEED HELP FINDING SUPPORT,
VISIT WWW.WANNATALKABOUTIT.COM
LAST DAY OF TRIAL
[reporter 1] Elize Matsunaga's trial
is almost over
[reporter 2] After seven days of trial,
it's considered one of the longest
in the history of São Paulo.
[Elize Matsunaga]
I knew there would be reporters there,
but I didn't think
there would be that many.
This line at Barra Funda Criminal Court
is made up of people who want to follow
I even asked myself, "Why?"
"Why are they so interested?"
[reporter 3] What sentence
does she deserve for killing her husband
[reporter 4]
Elize killed her husband for money.
[reporter 5]
She used to be a luxury escort
[reporter 6] One of the most
famous murderers in the country.
[Paula] This one reporter said,
"Wow, this is the last famous crime
going to trial."
She said, "Well, we need to make
another crime a big hit now."
I felt like
that is the power of the press.
It's a notorious crime.
In a way,
we're the ones who made it famous.
[dramatic music playing]
[Thaís] After all,
who is Elize Matsunaga?
To answer that question,
we went to her hometown.
Chopinzinho is located
in southwestern Paraná,
250 miles from the capital.
I went to Chopinzinho
just before the trial.
The arrival of a TV crew
with all that equipment,
cameras, microphone,
drew attention.
At first, my strategy
was talking to people
who were connected to Elize,
but not part of her family.
CHOPINZINHO
COUNTRYSIDE OF PARANÁ
[woman] I knew her mom,
but I didn't know she was her mother.
She'd never mentioned it.
But the driver told me. He said,
"She is the mother of that woman
who killed her husband in São Paulo."
And she showed up.
And when I saw her, I thought,
"Wow, her mom is really dark-skinned."
And she was a person that
She looked so pretty, her eyes
[woman 2] I used to work with her sister
over in the hospital.
All I remember is seeing the footage
of her taking the bags to the
What is it called? The
I forgot what it's called.
Oh, yeah, to the elevator.
Yeah, that's when we saw she killed him
and dismembered him.
That was it.
[interviewer]
Did people talk about it here?
Yes. Yes, they did.
Because she was born here.
- People talked a lot. A lot.
- [dog whines]
What if he threatened her
or did something to her?
She'd have to defend herself.
There's that, too.
When they heard about Chopinzinho,
people thought
of the Elize Matsunaga case,
the woman who chopped up the Yoki guy.
[Elize] It's a really small town.
It's inevitable that people talk
and point fingers.
Seeing my family in that situation,
running away from reporters
I remember my sister had to leave work
through the back door.
[Thaís] Visiting the house
where Elize grew up
was the last thing I did.
And I think reporters develop
some kind of instinct.
We came here
looking for Elize Matsunaga's relatives.
They used to live here, right?
[man] They did, but not anymore.
[Thaís] Not even her sister, uncle
No?
This man says he doesn't know her
but he's actually her stepfather.
He dodges the questions and seems to be
uncomfortable with the subject.
Do you happen to know
where her family is living now?
No, ma'am. I don't know
where they're living now.
[Thaís] I don't know
if it was the way he looked at me,
or the way he behaved,
but something was weird.
I called Elize's lawyer and asked him,
"Luciano, is there something
about the relationship
between Elize and her stepfather
that might be important to this case?"
And then he told me about it
under the condition that I didn't publish
anything about it at that moment,
because he intended
to reveal that in court.
[camera shutters clicking]
[suspenseful music playing]
[Luciano] My strategy in court
was to show the jury who Elize was.
I wanted it to be as long as possible
to drive the jury away
from the image they'd seen on TV.
[D'Urso] When there is a repercussion
on a lawsuit
that is widely publicized in advance,
the jury already had information
they'd gotten way before.
[gavel banging]
That is to say,
I need to humanize Elize for the jury.
[judge] Tell me this,
what is your hometown?
- Chopinzinho.
- State?
Paraná.
And your life there
modest, rich? Financially speaking.
My life was modest.
[Luciano] Elize went through
ups and downs.
And I wanted to show them her life
has never been a straight line. Never.
[judge] Did you live with your parents?
When my dad left my mom,
I moved in with my grandparents.
[Luciano] What did I need
to show the jury?
That her father abandoned her
when she was three.
Her mom had to leave town
to find a job as a housekeeper
in the capital.
When her mom comes back,
she's with her stepfather.
Her stepfather moves in.
She is no longer under the care
of her grandparents or her aunt.
THE '90s
[Elize] What I went through
with my stepfather,
I don't wish that on any woman.
I don't wish that on any person.
And I also have a sister.
She is his daughter.
I think she went through
some really tough situations.
This story coming to the surface,
emerging like that
[crying] It's still too hard for me
to talk about it.
[interviewer] Was it inside your house?
Yes.
[somber music playing]
[barking]
These things
they don't happen out of the blue.
Some situations come up
and we don't even notice them.
I remember one day it caught my attention
that he changed the bathroom lock.
He did it in such a way that
we couldn't lock the door from the inside.
So, I'd go to the bathroom
and I couldn't lock the door.
I had to keep the door unlocked.
Often, when I had
just gotten into the bathroom,
he'd open the door and say,
"Oh, I'm sorry.
I didn't know you were in there."
One day, I was showering
I was 15.
There was a tilting window
a small window in the bathroom.
There was a tree outside,
and I saw him looking at me.
I looked out the window and said,
"Who's there?"
At the time
I didn't even notice it was him
and I left running,
wrapped the towel around me, and
Then he came
and he grabbed me.
[somber music intensifies]
[judge] Did Elize suffer
any sexual violence?
I've always been suspicious.
She only confirmed it years later.
Who was it?
Her stepfather.
[Thaís] Elize's case
is not an isolated fact.
Every hour,
three children or teenagers
are sexually abused in Brazil.
In 75% of the cases, the offender
is a member of the child's family.
[water running]
[Elize] I wanted to rub my skin
until it bled.
And I thought I was the one to blame.
I'd look at myself
and feel ashamed of being a woman.
I was angry at God.
[Elize's lawyer] She didn't have anyone
to vent about what she was going through.
So, she kept holding that feeling
inside of her
and experiencing all that
that pain, that anguish.
[Elize] On that day,
I can't remember exactly what I did then.
I was desperate.
But I managed to get away from him.
And I ran.
I ran and I ran and I didn't
even know where I was going.
I just grabbed the towel and ran away.
After that day, I decided to leave.
I decided to run away from home.
I put some things in my backpack,
grabbed a knife,
as if I'd be able to defend myself
from the world.
I went to my godmother
and borrowed 50 bucks from her.
My intention was to go out into the world.
I remember
while I was walking along the road
[sniffles] with no destination,
not knowing where I'd go
a car was following me.
I was so
oblivious as to what
was going on around me,
I didn't even notice it.
And then the guy started talking to me,
"Hey, lady. Where are you going?"
And that woke me up.
As if I had woken up from a dream.
So I started running.
I started running and running.
I didn't know where to go.
It's so agonizing to keep running
while not knowing where to go.
I just knew I had to run.
I got into the bushes.
I
That seemed like
a good hiding place to me.
Like an animal escaping from something,
searching for a den.
I was there behind the bushes.
I don't know for how long
or for how many hours.
I remember I slept.
The next day,
I didn't know what to do.
I was lost and even afraid of leaving.
I smelled food.
Then I saw a man on a horse.
He told me his house was just ahead.
He showed me
he pointed to me where his house was.
It was a beautiful house
in the middle of the woods,
in the middle of a huge forest.
His house was beautiful.
So, I went there. I ate,
I slept.
The next day,
he called Child Protective Services.
I couldn't say anything. I didn't
[buzzing]
I was scared to go back home.
I was scared no one would believe me.
[keyboard clacking]
I kept silent.
I didn't say my name.
I even lied about my name, actually.
Forty-five days passed
before I went back home.
[Elize's aunt] Everyone was desperate
around here.
Us here at home, my sister
Everyone was desperately looking for her
calling Child Protective Services,
the police.
Then they eventually found her,
so my sister and I went to get her.
Then I went back home.
It was hard
because I didn't want to go back,
but I had nowhere else to go.
That changed me so much.
Maybe if that hadn't happened,
I wouldn't have been so desperate
to leave that place.
That's when she moves to her aunt's.
Rosie's.
She's the one person who's always been
by Elize's side the whole time.
[interviewer] Did she tell you why
she wanted to stay with you
and not her mother or her sister?
No.
She just said she
she didn't want to stay there.
So, I asked my sister
if she could stay with me.
I told her to leave her with me.
[Elize] I grew up without my father.
And that absence,
that bad feeling,
I didn't want my daughter
to feel that.
That had a lot of influence
on me trying to maintain my marriage.
Even when it wasn't so good.
Especially after I found out
about his first affair,
and after I found out about my pregnancy
when I'd already decided to get a divorce.
But it really influenced me.
I wanted my daughter to have a father,
unlike myself.
[judge] If you didn't want your daughter
to go through the same as you did,
not having a father,
then why did you kill him?
And what will you tell her
when you have the opportunity
to tell her you killed
and chopped up her father?
What was the reason?
I'll ask her for forgiveness.
I'll ask for forgiveness
and I'll tell her what happened
when the time is right.
She's just a child now.
- [prosecutor] Can I dismiss the witness?
- [judge] Yes, you can.
Any further questions,
members of the jury? No?
Okay.
I'm positive
Elize suffered emotional abuse.
She suffered psychological violence.
It was obvious
she suffered emotional abuse.
There was no dialogue between them.
There was, in fact,
an attempt on his part to subdue her.
The offender tries to instill false ideas
in the victim's mind.
Just like in parental alienation,
in which the spouse or the parent
also tries to instill false,
derogatory ideas
inside the child's mind.
That she was the one to blame
for that bad situation.
Based on what I know
about toxic relationships
by talking to victims,
and by my own experience,
when it comes to abusive relationships,
in 85% of cases,
the offenders are male.
It's not necessarily
about physical violence.
It's also about psychological violence,
verbal abuse.
[D'Urso] I think that
if this happens to someone,
no matter how bad it is,
separation is the solution.
As a matter of fact,
separation is what the law provides.
No one can be forced
to stay in a relationship.
I remember I started by saying,
"Marcos made a mistake, a huge mistake."
All right? But that doesn't justify
what happened to him in the end.
[D'Urso] Nothing justifies homicide.
Nothing.
And, unfortunately,
that was the path Elize chose.
LAST DAY OF TRIAL
[reporter 1] Elize might leave the court
through the front door
and even be acquitted.
How likely is that to happen?
Well, that can only be decided by the jury
based on their analyses.
Four women and three men
[reporter 2]will decide
Elize Matsunaga's sentence.
[reporter 3] Jurors have been gathered
for over two and a half hours.
The judge asked them to meet at 11:00 p.m.
Expectations are high.
[Juliana] I don't know if you've ever seen
how the voting works.
Each member gets a card
that says "yes" or "no."
Like a deck of cards.
The criteria are written beforehand.
The judge asks the questions,
and the jury members
cast their "yes" or "no" votes.
[Luciano] It's different from the U.S.
here in Brazil.
In the U.S., they have
a lot of information on the jurors.
We had very little information about them.
We knew their names and their jobs.
That's next to nothing.
They're not familiar
with the Criminal Code,
so, they're there to be convinced.
[Juliana] The judge then opens the bag,
counts the votes,
and, finally, writes down the results.
All of those answers
will define if that individual
who is being judged
is guilty or innocent.
If they are innocent,
then the matter is settled.
If they are guilty, the judge will then
need to establish the sentence.
When you go to the secret room
and the first item is voted,
which is authorship and concreteness,
no one, not a single soul,
will be able to contain the adrenaline
from going up.
The heart goes thud, thud, thud.
[tense music playing]
I remember that at a certain point
everyone had to leave the room.
And we spent a lot of time
in the reporters' room,
talking, sharing whatever food was left.
Because we were there for several hours.
It was too late to order a pizza.
It was almost 2:00 a.m.
[reporter] Right now, attention, please.
The courtroom doors have been opened,
and Elize Matsunaga's sentence
will be revealed
any time now.
Those minutes and seconds,
they were endless.
It seemed like it took longer
than the eight days I spent there.
I was very anxious.
A tremendous amount of anxiety.
In that single moment,
they'd decide my whole life.
Elize Araújo Kitano Matsunaga.
Please.
[unsettling music playing]
I was always sitting in the front row
with a panoramic view
of all the characters.
[D'Urso] Deep down, I was quite sure
that she would be convicted.
Let me tell you something.
I've never been afraid of the courtroom.
[Paula] Before the sentence,
he talked about the aggravators,
the votes of the jury
and what they understood.
[imperceptible]
And as the judge spoke,
it became clear
that two of the aggravators
weren't accepted by the jury.
"The sentence council recognizes
that of all aggravators,
there are enough consistent resources
to confirm
only the obstruction
of the victim's defense."
"It still recognized the materiality
and the authorship
of the crime
of mutilating and concealing a body."
[D'Urso] She had been accused
of committing third-degree murder
with foul motive and cruelty,
along with the impossibility
of the victim's defense.
The jury did not recognize all of that.
They only recognized the situation
that obstructed the victim's defense.
[reporter] The jury decided she did not
commit murder with foul motive,
and that her means were not cruel
since Marcos wasn't alive
when he was dismembered.
The defense was already celebrating,
almost jumping for joy for having
Well, it was definitely
a victory for them.
Her happiness
was a great moment of satisfaction for us.
- She was crying, right?
- She was crying.
[Luciano] Yeah, she was really crying.
[Paula] The defense was celebrating,
and the prosecution was outraged.
But when they heard the sentence,
everything immediately changed.
The final sentence
is established by the judge.
"have agreed on this,
on the sum of all sentences"
Our goal was to get her
a 30-year sentence,
which is the maximum penalty.
"with a total of 19 years, 11 months
and one day in prison."
[tense music playing]
Her sentence was basically 20 years.
The judge gave her
the longest sentence he could give her,
considering that two of the aggravators
weren't recognized.
[gavel banging]
[Thaís] No one was pleased.
One side wanted her
to leave through the front door,
and the other,
wanted her to get the maximum penalty.
The sentence applied by the judge
did not reflect the jury's decision.
He increased the sentence way too much.
There was no need for that at all.
That was not what the jury intended.
If you look at it as a game,
the defense definitely won.
It's undeniable.
It's undeniable
that the defense won the case.
If getting
Was it 19, almost 20 years, right?
If that is really a victory,
imagine what defeat would look like.
I don't think I won the case
because I wanted the aggravators.
What happened
was a brutal mistake of the jury.
I don't think the jury
is about winning or losing.
Otherwise, it'd be something personal.
The one being judged
is neither the defense,
nor the prosecution.
I asked the family
if they were interested in appealing
to increase the sentence.
And the family's position
was that justice had been served.
[judge] "Sentence signed in courtroom 10,
at 2:08 a.m., on December 5th, 2016,
by Adilson Paukoski Simoni,
presiding judge."
Have a good night.
Court is adjourned.
[interviewer] When the judge said,
"19 years," how did you feel?
Wow
I could just feel
and imagine and do the math of
how long it would take for me
to see my daughter.
How long and how many days
I would have to stay there
to finally see her again.
[somber music playing]
[Elize] Prison is hell.
There are things that
only a cell can do to you.
I've had to share a cell with one person,
with six other people,
with eight other people.
And I've had to share a cell
with 18 other people.
People there are living in survival mode.
[Thaís] We also need to know
who those inmates are.
Three out of ten of those inmates
didn't even go to trial.
We're talking about men and women
who are already in jail
without the law having decided
whether they're guilty or innocent.
For the most part, people in jail
are poor and Black
who are trafficking
small amounts of drugs.
So, Elize was an outlier there.
The dilemma of humanity
is how we should punish.
In the beginning,
there were death sentences.
At a certain point in history,
humanity found out
that by killing a convicted person,
their workforce would also die.
So when we look at the history
of the evolution
of the punishment sentences,
it's basically all about
the discovery of the fact
that instead of killing a convicted person
to punish them,
they could be punished
by keeping them alive and working.
That happened with the influence
of the Catholic Church,
which had in its monasteries,
places where individuals
who had violated the law
had to stay and pray.
And that area within the monastery
was called "penitentiary"
where there were cells
to pay the penances.
[sewing machine whirring]
[Elize] I learned how to sew there.
I learned how to manufacture pants,
for instance, shirts.
That allowed me to leave my cell
and go to a place where
where I was doing something.
I was working.
I was being helpful in some way.
[cell door opens]
[cell door closes]
[somber music playing]
[reverend] I went to visit her only once.
[reporter] Did Elize cry?
She did.
And she'd cry a lot
when she talked about her daughter.
[Elize] When she was born,
she was so fragile.
[sobs]
So tiny.
I wanted to put her in a bubble, you know?
By irony of fate,
I burst that bubble myself.
I have a spiritual bond with her.
I know I'll see her again.
I pray for that to happen.
It won't be easy
but that's my next goal.
FURLOUGH
I want to go back to having
a low-key life,
like I used to have.
Like I enjoyed having.
[rain pattering]
Without bothering people,
causing a fuss,
or annoying people.
Just living my life.
I'm so happy I'm going to see her.
I'm really happy.
I can hardly believe it.
[interviewer] How long has it been
since you've seen your grandmother?
Seven years.
It's been seven years, six months
and 20 days.
I haven't seen my grandmother
since I was arrested.
She's 86. It's hard for her.
It's really complicated to get around
and it's too far away from their place.
I made her a gift.
I sewed a tablecloth with daisies.
It's so her.
I hope she likes it.
[reporter] Elize Matsunaga left prison
for the first time
since her arrest for murdering
[reporter 2] Elize won't be able
to see her daughter.
[reporter 3] It's absurd
that these inmates get to leave.
Going to jail for serious crimes in Brazil
is like winning a prize.
They all look strong,
with their nails done.
Look, they're smiling.
It's the law, it's written.
But the people don't like it.
[reporter 4] Since inmates
aren't monitored in any way,
temporary releases spread thousands
of criminals through the streets.
Temporary releases are, in fact,
a temptation to escape,
an invitation for crime,
and an open door to chaos.
[Juliana] They're really about
resocialization.
Inmates who behave well
and meet certain requisites
demanded by the national prison law
have the right to temporarily leave
in certain
It's five times a year.
It lasts about five or six days on average
depending on the holiday.
In layman's terms, it may be frowned upon,
"Oh, the criminal
is out in the streets." But no.
The sentence is not eternal.
The person has been judged
and resocialization is part
of this instrument we call the "sentence,"
so the person can come back to society.
A person who has been sentenced to jail
has to gradually adapt to freedom
under the control of the State,
so they have better chances of leading,
from then on,
a life without risks
of committing more crimes.
It's a fact that Elize has rights.
That's a right the law has given her.
The law allows her that.
It's awful. I think it's awful.
If she committed a crime in 2012,
and then she's already out on the streets
in 2019,
she served time for around seven years
for killing someone.
I can't be the judge of that, you know?
The people can be the judge and decide
if that's really necessary.
[Figueira] I even heard
she was about to be released.
In the process of being released.
I think that's what the grandparents
are concerned about.
That this could create some fuss
with the daughter.
[Elize] Being able to leave for some days
and getting to solve a few things
is really significant to me.
It's really important.
I need to take these steps.
[Juliana] She used her release
to organize her life,
to take steps towards her future,
to be able to see her daughter again.
Elize has this clarity and consciousness
about what she wants.
She wants to, and she will be able
to rebuild an affectionate bond
with her daughter again. Little by little.
So I'm working and I'm putting effort
into providing that opportunity for her.
And she deserves that.
Nowadays, Elize,
she has had her parental rights
over her daughter suspended.
That means that during this period,
she can't demand to visit her.
This was right after the crime,
right after she got arrested.
It was a different scenario back in 2012.
There hadn't been a trial yet.
We weren't sure about
what would be decided.
[indistinct chatter]
[Juliana] Now that she's almost done,
I'll ask them to revoke it,
so that she can legally,
and under supervision,
see her daughter for a few hours.
[chatter continues]
[interviewer] Do you think her daughter
knows about Elize?
She does.
Elize's father-in-law said
she has known about the crime
and about her mother
for a year and a half.
[interviewer] What if Elize says
her goal now
is to have the right to have
custody of her daughter
or at least see her?
I can't talk about that
because of the attorney-client privilege.
The only thing I can say
is that the family's priority
is to protect the daughter.
This child's lost her mom
when she was arrested,
and she's lost her dad
because he was murdered,
and at such a tender age,
she has to deal with this tragedy
that has been imposed on her.
What the family is doing,
and has been doing since the beginning
YOKI CASE: EXECUTIVE IS BURIED
is preparing their granddaughter
for when she learns about it
in the future.
[Flávio] All of their interest,
all their emotional reactions
were directed at the grandchild
who became the focus of attention.
[somber music playing]
It's a stigma they'll carry for life.
It doesn't end with the pain of death.
It's something that has terrible
consequences that linger, you know.
What we feel as friends is just a fraction
of what his daughters will feel
having to grow up explaining that story.
They'll have to tell that story
when they go to school,
when they go to college,
when they get a boyfriend,
when they get married.
They'll have to explain it
to their children and grandchildren.
So they will never be done explaining it.
It'll keep echoing forever.
[somber music playing]
[Elize] I don't know
what the future holds for us.
I don't know if someday
I'll be able to meet her again.
I hope I will.
I pray to God for it.
I pray to Mary for it
because she's a mother too.
[church bells tolling]
I'd like to tell my daughter that
not even a day goes by
that I don't feel guilty about what I did.
And I pray that she
manages to overcome that.
If she can't forgive me,
that's fine. I will respect her.
[solemn music playing]
Something very curious happened to me.
I was in jail,
and I was fortunate enough
to dream about her
the whole night.
I didn't dream about her
as a baby.
I dreamed about her
as how she'd be right now.
With this long
black hair,
just like her father's.
[chuckles softly] Almond-shaped eyes.
She was laughing a lot.
She was
she was about this tall, give or take.
I've never felt more peaceful in my life
than in the moments
when I was holding her in my arms.
I'd look at her
The mental picture I have of her
is still like that.
I don't know what she looks like now.
[melancholy music playing]
My life right now
is like the stories
mothers tell their kids to scare them.
This girl that worked with me,
she was very young.
She was arrested when she was 18.
And she used to tell me,
"You know, Elize,
there was this man in my hometown
who was in jail for 10 years.
I would cross the street
whenever I saw him
because I was scared.
Will people do that to us as well?
Once we're back home,
will people do that when they see us?"
[interviewer] Are you afraid
of what might happen
when you go back to Chopinzinho?
I'm not going back there.
I chose to go to a nearby city.
I'm gonna see my grandma.
I don't even know what will happen
because
I talked to her on the phone yesterday,
and she told me she had back pains
and it was rough.
Moving around is so hard for her,
you know?
But I'm happy I'm going there.
No, no. I'm I'm here.
I'm already here.
Yeah, 301.
Just bring what's important.
Stuff you couldn't leave in the car.
I really admire my grandmother.
She was the one who took care
of me and my sister,
and she's faced a lot of hardships
in her life.
I want to hug her again.
That's as important to me
as being able to hug my daughter.
[Elize crying]
Oh, my God. Don't cry, honey.
These are tears of joy, Granny.
I know. I cannot cry
because I took so many prescribed meds
that I can't cry anymore,
even if my heart bursts.
- I know they're tears of joy.
- They're tears of joy, Granny,
not sadness.
Oh, I'm so glad God allowed us to meet.
God is wonderful.
You look so beautiful, Granny.
Thank you. Do you think so?
Yes, you look amazing.
You're so, so beautiful, Granny.
- You look beautiful too.
- Are you okay?
- Yes, thank God.
- What about your back?
And your legs? Come on, let's take a seat.
Oh, goodness. You look so pretty.
Oh, come on.
[gentle music playing]
[crying] And I'll always love you.
Always. Always.
I was so scared
I wouldn't be able to see you again.
But God allowed us to meet.
[Elize] All these years I prayed that
I could meet her once more.
[sobs] That I could tell her
from the bottom of my heart,
"Your granddaughter
is right here, Granny."
I made you something. I hope you like it.
[laughs softly]
It's a tablecloth.
I embroidered it.
You did this yourself?
[Maria Sebastiana]
She made a mistake, a big mistake.
She's paying a high price for her mistake.
But what I think hurts her the most
is her daughter.
That's the highest price she's paying.
I hope one day her daughter understands it
and forgives her.
That she'll listen to her version,
read the letters she wrote her,
the things she made for her.
I'd like to be able to show her
all that someday.
- Let me give you a hug.
- How are you?
- Oh, my God.
- I wish you all the best.
May God and your guardian angels
be with you always.
I always want to see you happy and pretty
like you are now.
Very pretty, okay?
Don't cry. God is with you.
- God and the guardian angels, always.
- Amen. Amen. Amen.
[crying] And they'll be with you too.
Thank you, Granny.
[Cosenzo] She's already lost
her parental rights.
What she can get back
is her daughter's love.
Love doesn't need bonds, documents,
determinations of codes
or anything like that.
It'll depend on her.
[D'Urso] I believe
that justice was served.
As for her sentence,
she will take it up with the State
and will do her time.
And what she'll do with her life later on,
that only concerns her and God.
[Elize] There's no way
I could just pretend that
the past doesn't exist.
What I can do now,
is try to live with the past
in the best way that I can.
I didn't think things would have escalated
to the extent that they have.
And I still can't understand
why people are so curious about it.
Just imagine if Elize were
were a cleaning lady
If Marcos Matsunaga were Black and poor.
would it have gotten
all the attention it did?
Of course not.
And why?
[Thaís] The crime Elize has committed
against Marcos,
we usually see that on TV
with the characters reversed.
A man who kills his wife
because he couldn't accept
the end of their relationship.
[soft music playing]
[interviewer sighs]
[interviewer] Is there anything else
you'd like to say
before we finish the interview?
Uh
The types of crimes
I learned about in prison
There are
crimes that are way more barbaric
than mine,
way more shocking than mine,
but nobody mentions them.
Nobody talks about them,
because the victim wasn't wealthy.
The victim was an ordinary person.
Someone poor.
If it had been the opposite, for example,
if I had lost my life in this situation,
not Marcos,
would he be here talking about it?
Would there be spotlights on him
and people eager to know,
"What about the victim, Elize?"
Who would I be?
[somber music playing]
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ST. MARIA EUFRÁSIA PELLETIER
[dark version of Beethoven's
"Bagatelle No. 25 (Für Elise)" playing]
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