Animal, Vegetable, Mineral? (21952) s03e02 Episode Script
The Manchester Museum
Manchester, which has a splendid and varied collection of all kinds of things, as we shall all see very soon.
And now to the first object.
Here it is.
It'slight brown in colour.
And Sir Mortimer is having difficulty making it stand up! Now, there it is.
Now, this is what it is.
And now, Sir Mortimer, what is this little personality? I've a sort of feeling that Dr Rainey knows all about it.
He has a knowing look in his eye.
He's not going to have it his way.
There are two finger-holes here.
One side has a little chap with a grin on his face and on the other side there is a little chap looking rather sad for himself.
And since In view of the expression on Dr Rainey's face, I can't help thinking it comes from the North, from the Eskimos which Dr Rainey knows so well.
I don't know, it's a pure guess.
I hope I haven't misled you, Sir Mortimer.
But I think this is a twisted man.
See the little face, - with the strings on the mouth? All twisted? - Yes, yes.
And it's a finger mask, I think, used by the Eskimos and it represents some spirit, some guardian spirit, two of them, really.
The one on this side who is very sour, with his mouth turned down, and this is the twisted man, the figure's in the mythology.
But the location of it I think is more difficult.
Perhaps Dr Bushwell can help me out.
It should be Alaska, should be somewhere along the coast, I'm not sure whether it should be South, Hooper Bay? - What do you think? - No, I can't place it more precisely.
I mean, beyond saying that it was Eskimo.
It's extraordinarily like a microphone, actually.
ALL LAUGH So, the experts have - Looking sour on this side.
- Yes, yes.
The experts have done very well, that is what it is, an Eskimo finger mask with these two faces, and from Alaska, as Dr Rainey identified.
Three marks for the experts for their first object and now we move to the second one.
Here it is.
It's also light brown in colour.
This is what it is.
And now, Dr Bushwell.
What do you make of this? It's a horrible-looking thing, I should think it's probably made of some form of whalebone.
But It's all smooth at the top here.
I should think it's been used as some kind of anvil, for hammering things out on.
- Yes.
- But where it comes from, I just don't know.
Is this what you mean, Dr Bushnell, where it's been cut, here? No, up on the top.
There.
This bit is polished.
- That's a process.
That's polished.
- Mmm-hmm.
Well, if it's - In a way, it looks pathological.
- Does it? Why should it be polished on both edges here? If it's a sea mammal, it's probably the part of the flipper of a walrus, wouldn't you say? But I'm not sure it's a sea mammal, what do you think? I'm only giving them one mark for this, because they weren't very sure about what part of what was the anvil.
But they got it, it is actually an elephant toe bone and it comes from an Upper Palaeolithic level in Creswell Crags in Derbyshire.
And the curator of Manchester Museum tells me he thinks this is how they were used, actually, with the bone put in the hand like that and the flakes pressed off like that.
I don't know whether that is the actual technique, but it's a fairly convincing demonstration of the result.
From Creswell Crags, Upper Pleistocene, 40,000 BC or some such date as that.
Now, let's move onto the next object.
Here it is.
Light cream-brown in colour, as everything seems to be in this programme so far.
This is what it is.
And now, Dr Rainey, it's time you had something to start off with.
Not a serious weapon, no.
Definitely not.
- What are you saying? A toy pellet gun from the Amazon? - Yes.
- Where? - Any reaction to that, Glyn? - You give me a reaction.
- Where's it from? Brazil? Well, not exactly on the Amazon, it's all very much the same.
I think to remember seeing something like this before on one of our programmes, isn't that so? - Well, it must've been when I was asleep.
- Ah.
Quite possibly, quite possibly.
- We can agree, it's not old.
It's something recently made - No, no.
It's modern The last century.
Is it from the East? - The rattan? What does that do? - Well - Your country didn't draw fire from Glyn at all.
- No.
No comment, was there? - But it's just - Australia? If you would find that it was not from the Amazon, as he suggested, it might be from several other areas.
Is there any way of knowing whether it comes from the Amazon or other areas? - I don't think there is.
- Well, it must be tropical.
- That's what I mean.
- This sort of wrapping is tropical.
- Where else could it be, the Pacific? South East Asia? - No.
I think the right answer is, in the terms of this the right answer, is that it is something that comes from where those materials are available and I don't think you could say whether it's Amazon or South East Asia or where it actually happens to come from, which is central Africa.
- Borneo? - I don't think you could know.
How many marks do you want for that? It doesn't shoot, by the way, a pellet.
It shoots a little dart, and I'm going to have the great pleasure of doing something that I've wanted to do for a terribly long time, which is shoot something at the studio manager.
ALL LAUGH If I can work it.
Does it work? There you are, Mr Day.
It didn't go far enough.
Well Two marks, shall we compromise on that? Two marks.
It's actually from central Africa and it's a toy gun, as you said.
Now, this comes the moment when I leave my seat and we change round with Dr Rainey.
I hope, Dr Daniel, I can return the compliments on these objects.
Let's have a look at the next one.
It's dark brown in colour this time.
This is what it is.
I don't know whose turn it is this time, but I'd like to give this one to Dr Daniel.
What do you make of this? Now, Glyn, don't be nervous.
- The chairman isn't as formidable as you think he is.
- No, no, no.
Well, now, this might be an ethnographical object.
It might be almost anything.
I'm fairly sure that it is not ancient.
It's certainly not Prehistoric.
I should put it as mediaeval or later English or an ethnographical object, I don't know which.
I should think it's some kind of bill hook? Of some kind? An object like that? - A bush hook? - Bush hook, bill hook.
- What do you think? - It's not an ethnographical object.
- Oh no, I don't think so.
- You think it's Middle English? Middle English or even older.
I should have thought to put it - Put it back? - Yes.
It's awfully like some of the things that we've got in hoards of Roman iron-work in this country.
- So, you're going to put it back to the Romans.
- Possibly.
It's some kind of hook.
There are a great many puzzles in those hoards of Roman iron-work.
A Roman bill hook? Well, it is one of those bill hooks which never varied from age to age.
- It's the use! - Except they don't go back.
- That's very important here, I think.
- Chopping hedges down.
A pruning hook? For cutting trees or hedges of some kind, I should say.
- It could be used for that.
- What's the material? - Iron.
- Iron, iron.
Can't be older than the Iron Age, then.
And you think it's some sort of cutting tool? Not used by the Druids for cutting down mistletoe.
Too heavy.
What do you think, Dr Bushnell, about the age? - I think it's Roman.
- Roman? - Yes.
- And no earlier than that? - No.
I suppose it could be early Iron Age, but I don't know why.
- Roman or later, I would say.
- You like that, Glyn? - Mmm.
- Not so bad.
I think we'll stick to that, whatever the museum was saying! I shall be very surprised to find it in an early Iron Age context, - or perhaps there are few, are there? - It's Roman or even later.
I don't know of anything like that in the Iron Age.
I do know Roman things like that.
Well, thank you, gentlemen, let me have a look at it.
I don't know quite what to score you on this.
Actually, the use was the important thing here, I think.
It's a cutting edge to a plough, an iron plough coulter.
You see? Passing this way, cutting a sod, and then it turns the sod on the ploughshare below.
It comes from the Bigbury Camp of Iron Age in Kent, 500 BC to 500 AD.
So, very close to your Roman times.
Now, I think a fair score on this is two, since you got very close to the time That's far more generous than I should have been! Far more generous! Next time it'll be more difficult.
Let me score two on this one.
That would be seven, eight.
Let's have a look at our next one.
The colour of this is white and sort of yellow, orange, yellow.
This is what it is.
Don't you think we ought to give this one to Daniel, too? - Or should we give this to Bushnell? - He can pass them on.
When I have him in the spot, it seems to me the thing.
We should start out with it.
They don't smell.
Although they are horrible little things.
I think they're attached to sandals, though for what purpose, - I don't know.
- Heels? Of course, they may have been used in some kind of game, though I don't quite see what sort of game.
Both worn by On the sandals of players in an obscure game.
You mean like the pom-poms on the Greek sandals? - You like that, Dr Bushnell? - Not much.
ALL LAUGH - You'd be right, you know.
- I don't know what they are! Horrible looking things.
- They're used in pairs, obviously.
- Yes.
What's that hole in the top? - It's for pushing the top of the bedstead through.
- I see.
I think we really have a puzzler this time.
What's the material? Does that help you any? Well, it's leather.
Yes, leather, some sort of chamois leather.
It belongs to some sort of sophisticated people.
I suppose it's one of these horrible folk things.
- For all of us ethnographers, that's always difficult, no? - Yes.
Ritual objects used at Christmas.
- Beats me.
- Rick, you know them? No, I don't think I know these chaps.
- No idea, Rick? - Wait a minute, let me have a look at them.
Somehow it seems to me that ought to be down your line.
- Down my line? - I know just why.
Well, what is my line? - You tell me what my line is.
- Oh, I won't, now.
Very hard I sympathise with the panel, and I'm glad you're in this position, not me.
No, I think I'm going to give this one up.
I don't know.
Well, I think that's probably wise, at this point.
Actually, you may be surprised at this, but these are boxing gloves worn by fighting cocks and they come from Lancashire in the last century.
These are put on when you're just training your cocks to fight so they won't hurt themselves.
But when you have the real business, the real fights, you have these things put on over the spurs, and then they're really dangerous.
But these are to save the cock.
I didn't know until this evening that you had cock fights in Great Britain.
- We don't appreciate them.
- He's an expert on them.
But we always use the spurs, you know? On this one, I think we can't score the panel at all, I am sorry to say.
So, we'll just pass that one up and move on to our next one.
This is another kind of light grey stone.
And this is what it is.
I must say, there's a mistake in the announcement here.
This comes from the Mousterian Period, but the date is about 50,000.
There's a mistake in the numbers here, we'll have to correct that .
.
later.
Well, I'm afraid I've given you a bit of a clue, Rick.
Had you not said anything, - Dr Rainey, I would've said it was of the Mousterian Period.
- Good! - That's very easy for you, Rick.
That's not really the problem.
- No.
The location of this is the real problem.
Well, a geological problem, isn't it? You a geologist, Glyn? - No, but Geoffrey is.
- Anyway, it's a good deal older than you said.
Older than your 50,000 years.
I don't think I've really given much away here, because it's the location that really is the problem on this one.
- Is made of quartzite, is it? - Yes, yes, yes.
- So it doesn't come from England? - I shouldn't think so.
- It's a very cruel instrument.
- Could it come from India? - Couldn't come from any of the - It might.
It might.
But I wouldn't swear to it at all.
- It's a cruel, sort of chopping - Chopping tool.
It might be older than Mousterian, actually.
It might come from India or Africa.
It's an extremely crude thing, just made out of a quartzite pebble, they've just knocked one end of it about.
I don't think it comes from India.
We have a good many in the museum which are supposed to come from the stone of India and they are generally much more deeply stained than this.
That's not infallible.
The thing of Indochina, the things that are called chopping tools? Well, I'm not into Yes, it's a chopping chopper.
Are you thinking of the zone of West India.
Yes, north-west India, yes.
I don't think it's that, but it's an extremely crude thing made of a quartzite pebble.
- If it is an artefact, is it - If it is an artefact.
But I wonder, if it is something larger, a large pebble that has broken.
There is very clear flaking.
But that's the quartzite.
- I wouldn't guarantee that it is made by man.
- You wouldn't? - I wouldn't guarantee.
- Would you locate it, Rick? No, it's a matter of geology, and I don't profess to be a geologist.
Not the type, at all? It's like those chopper chopping tools of the Stone period.
It might be 250,000 years old, more like that, easily.
It might also be a large natural pebble which has been broken in half.
Do you like South East Asia for the location? You won't commit yourself? - I won't commit myself.
- How about you, Glyn? I won't commit myself.
It might be there.
Well, I can see I didn't give anything away on this one! You see, actually, it comes from Creswell, the Creswell Caves in Derbyshire and there was a mistake in the announcement.
Is there much Mousterian there? Well, it's called Mousterian, the Manchester Museum, 50,000 to 100,000 years old.
Dug up by Boyd Dawkins at the Creswell Caves.
I wouldn't put many shirts on that.
You wouldn't? You wouldn't agree with that? Oh, I don't think so, on the whole.
I hate to be very severe in scoring this one, but I can't really give you any score at all.
You won't argue with that, will you? Let's move along to our next one.
I think this is the time that I should turn back to Glyn Daniel, with great pleasure.
Now, viewers may be amused to know that Well, I mean, it's for sharpening and something was kept in here, it must be a knife rack, mustn't it? - For a knife, an axe? - An axe? Several knives? Thrust in here, you sharpen them? - Sgian dubh? - Little pieces in there.
That's a piece of curatorial work.
It looks like some of these things you find in the open-air museum in Stockholm, where they have the houses in the open-air museum, you know? - You think so? - I think so.
The wood isn't dried out.
It's modern.
Yes, but the wood isn't dry.
It's Southern.
- I should have thought so.
Yes.
- It's tropical wood.
That's the wrong lead there, I'm sure.
It's far more like some of the Dao sheaths that you get in Assam.
It's not far from there.
It may not be Assam, and maybe Burma, something like that.
- Could you explain what you mean by that? - A Dao? A Dao is a sort of, a kind of axe.
And they put the head of it here.
And did you say where it was found? Well, they're very You get things very like this in Assam.
And maybe a bit further south, I'm not sure.
- Those chaps who don't wear shoes.
The Nagas use them.
- The Nagas, yes.
- What you think, Dr Rainey? - Well, the design It could be from that area all right.
There's crosshatching.
And certainly the wood is all right.
You got split bamboo here, isn't it? I wouldn't I certainly couldn't argue with that.
There it is.
Which is a grey-black in colour.
This is what it is.
And now, Geoffrey, is this in your line? - Looks like part of a roller skate, doesn't it? - Very much, yes.
- Part of a roller skate.
- Not seriously, Daniel.
It's stone, to begin with.
Yes, it's made of stone and it's got a small hole through it.
Um It could be a spindle whorl.
It's rather heavy for that.
But it hasn't much wear around the rim, so I think probably on the whole, that's what it is.
But where it comes from, I'd hate to say.
- Do you not think it's a loom weight? - I should doubt that.
- It's too symmetrical for that.
- I don't think it's heavy enough.
- It's kind of an non-descript thing.
- It's a non-descript thing, yes.
If it's a spindle, then there should be a hole through here for the shaft.
Well, it could be, I suppose a loom weight, but I don't know why, and anyway it could be much more practical for that case.
- I'm afraid this is beyond me.
Rick? - We have got to so far? It's loom weight or a spindle whorl made of stone.
I think is definitely a spindle whorl.
Put it on a spindle like a flywheel, this pencil isn't big enough but turn it round and give impetus to the spindle, when you have the thread.
It could be from anywhere.
The south-west of America If it's from this country, it's probably about 2000 years old.
Plus and minus, I don't know.
- What is it made of? - I thought you were going to ask that.
Do you mind if I cut a slice off it? Yes, you can, but I'm sure the museum doesn't want you to.
- I willaccept the date of 2000.
- Where is the museum curator? Is he looking? Could you look at the edge.
You haven't looked at the edge.
- Which edge? - The outside edge.
- Yes.
- Is it a circular thing? No.
Oh.
It's I mustn't do that.
- No.
- That would be the end.
Couldn't be a clubhead.
- It's a fossilised something.
- Ah! Now we're getting somewhere.
- Shell? - No, it's not a shell.
Wait a minute.
It's very heavy.
It isn't like an ordinary stone, it's a spindle whorl Made out of something.
I've accepted that it's a spindle whorl, I've accepted that it's 2000 years ago, which it take to be a general date for the early Iron Age.
Something of that kind.
But what is made of? You said at first it was made of stone, - and that may possibly be legally correct.
- Fossilised - Not a shell, but a worm of some sort, isn't it? - No! It's a vertebra of something.
- It is, it is.
- It's a fossil vertebra.
Yes, it's the fossilised vertebra of an Ichthyosaurus and we are going to end this programme by having an Ichthyosaurus for you to see.
I'll give the panel three more marks and see, that has brought us up to 14, but it hasn't really brought us within measurable distance of 20.
Here is the old Ichthyosaurus, and we end our programme with this fossilised vertebrae and this charming person leering at the panel.
Well, now, that's the end of the programme tonight.
With my assistance, the panel have lost.
In a programme in a fortnight's time, the challengers will be at the Sheffield Museum and the panel will consist of Adrian Digby, of Hugh Short, and of Edward Wenham, who was formerly editor of The Connoisseur.
Until then, with our thanks again to Dr Rainey and the rest of the panel, good night.
And now to the first object.
Here it is.
It'slight brown in colour.
And Sir Mortimer is having difficulty making it stand up! Now, there it is.
Now, this is what it is.
And now, Sir Mortimer, what is this little personality? I've a sort of feeling that Dr Rainey knows all about it.
He has a knowing look in his eye.
He's not going to have it his way.
There are two finger-holes here.
One side has a little chap with a grin on his face and on the other side there is a little chap looking rather sad for himself.
And since In view of the expression on Dr Rainey's face, I can't help thinking it comes from the North, from the Eskimos which Dr Rainey knows so well.
I don't know, it's a pure guess.
I hope I haven't misled you, Sir Mortimer.
But I think this is a twisted man.
See the little face, - with the strings on the mouth? All twisted? - Yes, yes.
And it's a finger mask, I think, used by the Eskimos and it represents some spirit, some guardian spirit, two of them, really.
The one on this side who is very sour, with his mouth turned down, and this is the twisted man, the figure's in the mythology.
But the location of it I think is more difficult.
Perhaps Dr Bushwell can help me out.
It should be Alaska, should be somewhere along the coast, I'm not sure whether it should be South, Hooper Bay? - What do you think? - No, I can't place it more precisely.
I mean, beyond saying that it was Eskimo.
It's extraordinarily like a microphone, actually.
ALL LAUGH So, the experts have - Looking sour on this side.
- Yes, yes.
The experts have done very well, that is what it is, an Eskimo finger mask with these two faces, and from Alaska, as Dr Rainey identified.
Three marks for the experts for their first object and now we move to the second one.
Here it is.
It's also light brown in colour.
This is what it is.
And now, Dr Bushwell.
What do you make of this? It's a horrible-looking thing, I should think it's probably made of some form of whalebone.
But It's all smooth at the top here.
I should think it's been used as some kind of anvil, for hammering things out on.
- Yes.
- But where it comes from, I just don't know.
Is this what you mean, Dr Bushnell, where it's been cut, here? No, up on the top.
There.
This bit is polished.
- That's a process.
That's polished.
- Mmm-hmm.
Well, if it's - In a way, it looks pathological.
- Does it? Why should it be polished on both edges here? If it's a sea mammal, it's probably the part of the flipper of a walrus, wouldn't you say? But I'm not sure it's a sea mammal, what do you think? I'm only giving them one mark for this, because they weren't very sure about what part of what was the anvil.
But they got it, it is actually an elephant toe bone and it comes from an Upper Palaeolithic level in Creswell Crags in Derbyshire.
And the curator of Manchester Museum tells me he thinks this is how they were used, actually, with the bone put in the hand like that and the flakes pressed off like that.
I don't know whether that is the actual technique, but it's a fairly convincing demonstration of the result.
From Creswell Crags, Upper Pleistocene, 40,000 BC or some such date as that.
Now, let's move onto the next object.
Here it is.
Light cream-brown in colour, as everything seems to be in this programme so far.
This is what it is.
And now, Dr Rainey, it's time you had something to start off with.
Not a serious weapon, no.
Definitely not.
- What are you saying? A toy pellet gun from the Amazon? - Yes.
- Where? - Any reaction to that, Glyn? - You give me a reaction.
- Where's it from? Brazil? Well, not exactly on the Amazon, it's all very much the same.
I think to remember seeing something like this before on one of our programmes, isn't that so? - Well, it must've been when I was asleep.
- Ah.
Quite possibly, quite possibly.
- We can agree, it's not old.
It's something recently made - No, no.
It's modern The last century.
Is it from the East? - The rattan? What does that do? - Well - Your country didn't draw fire from Glyn at all.
- No.
No comment, was there? - But it's just - Australia? If you would find that it was not from the Amazon, as he suggested, it might be from several other areas.
Is there any way of knowing whether it comes from the Amazon or other areas? - I don't think there is.
- Well, it must be tropical.
- That's what I mean.
- This sort of wrapping is tropical.
- Where else could it be, the Pacific? South East Asia? - No.
I think the right answer is, in the terms of this the right answer, is that it is something that comes from where those materials are available and I don't think you could say whether it's Amazon or South East Asia or where it actually happens to come from, which is central Africa.
- Borneo? - I don't think you could know.
How many marks do you want for that? It doesn't shoot, by the way, a pellet.
It shoots a little dart, and I'm going to have the great pleasure of doing something that I've wanted to do for a terribly long time, which is shoot something at the studio manager.
ALL LAUGH If I can work it.
Does it work? There you are, Mr Day.
It didn't go far enough.
Well Two marks, shall we compromise on that? Two marks.
It's actually from central Africa and it's a toy gun, as you said.
Now, this comes the moment when I leave my seat and we change round with Dr Rainey.
I hope, Dr Daniel, I can return the compliments on these objects.
Let's have a look at the next one.
It's dark brown in colour this time.
This is what it is.
I don't know whose turn it is this time, but I'd like to give this one to Dr Daniel.
What do you make of this? Now, Glyn, don't be nervous.
- The chairman isn't as formidable as you think he is.
- No, no, no.
Well, now, this might be an ethnographical object.
It might be almost anything.
I'm fairly sure that it is not ancient.
It's certainly not Prehistoric.
I should put it as mediaeval or later English or an ethnographical object, I don't know which.
I should think it's some kind of bill hook? Of some kind? An object like that? - A bush hook? - Bush hook, bill hook.
- What do you think? - It's not an ethnographical object.
- Oh no, I don't think so.
- You think it's Middle English? Middle English or even older.
I should have thought to put it - Put it back? - Yes.
It's awfully like some of the things that we've got in hoards of Roman iron-work in this country.
- So, you're going to put it back to the Romans.
- Possibly.
It's some kind of hook.
There are a great many puzzles in those hoards of Roman iron-work.
A Roman bill hook? Well, it is one of those bill hooks which never varied from age to age.
- It's the use! - Except they don't go back.
- That's very important here, I think.
- Chopping hedges down.
A pruning hook? For cutting trees or hedges of some kind, I should say.
- It could be used for that.
- What's the material? - Iron.
- Iron, iron.
Can't be older than the Iron Age, then.
And you think it's some sort of cutting tool? Not used by the Druids for cutting down mistletoe.
Too heavy.
What do you think, Dr Bushnell, about the age? - I think it's Roman.
- Roman? - Yes.
- And no earlier than that? - No.
I suppose it could be early Iron Age, but I don't know why.
- Roman or later, I would say.
- You like that, Glyn? - Mmm.
- Not so bad.
I think we'll stick to that, whatever the museum was saying! I shall be very surprised to find it in an early Iron Age context, - or perhaps there are few, are there? - It's Roman or even later.
I don't know of anything like that in the Iron Age.
I do know Roman things like that.
Well, thank you, gentlemen, let me have a look at it.
I don't know quite what to score you on this.
Actually, the use was the important thing here, I think.
It's a cutting edge to a plough, an iron plough coulter.
You see? Passing this way, cutting a sod, and then it turns the sod on the ploughshare below.
It comes from the Bigbury Camp of Iron Age in Kent, 500 BC to 500 AD.
So, very close to your Roman times.
Now, I think a fair score on this is two, since you got very close to the time That's far more generous than I should have been! Far more generous! Next time it'll be more difficult.
Let me score two on this one.
That would be seven, eight.
Let's have a look at our next one.
The colour of this is white and sort of yellow, orange, yellow.
This is what it is.
Don't you think we ought to give this one to Daniel, too? - Or should we give this to Bushnell? - He can pass them on.
When I have him in the spot, it seems to me the thing.
We should start out with it.
They don't smell.
Although they are horrible little things.
I think they're attached to sandals, though for what purpose, - I don't know.
- Heels? Of course, they may have been used in some kind of game, though I don't quite see what sort of game.
Both worn by On the sandals of players in an obscure game.
You mean like the pom-poms on the Greek sandals? - You like that, Dr Bushnell? - Not much.
ALL LAUGH - You'd be right, you know.
- I don't know what they are! Horrible looking things.
- They're used in pairs, obviously.
- Yes.
What's that hole in the top? - It's for pushing the top of the bedstead through.
- I see.
I think we really have a puzzler this time.
What's the material? Does that help you any? Well, it's leather.
Yes, leather, some sort of chamois leather.
It belongs to some sort of sophisticated people.
I suppose it's one of these horrible folk things.
- For all of us ethnographers, that's always difficult, no? - Yes.
Ritual objects used at Christmas.
- Beats me.
- Rick, you know them? No, I don't think I know these chaps.
- No idea, Rick? - Wait a minute, let me have a look at them.
Somehow it seems to me that ought to be down your line.
- Down my line? - I know just why.
Well, what is my line? - You tell me what my line is.
- Oh, I won't, now.
Very hard I sympathise with the panel, and I'm glad you're in this position, not me.
No, I think I'm going to give this one up.
I don't know.
Well, I think that's probably wise, at this point.
Actually, you may be surprised at this, but these are boxing gloves worn by fighting cocks and they come from Lancashire in the last century.
These are put on when you're just training your cocks to fight so they won't hurt themselves.
But when you have the real business, the real fights, you have these things put on over the spurs, and then they're really dangerous.
But these are to save the cock.
I didn't know until this evening that you had cock fights in Great Britain.
- We don't appreciate them.
- He's an expert on them.
But we always use the spurs, you know? On this one, I think we can't score the panel at all, I am sorry to say.
So, we'll just pass that one up and move on to our next one.
This is another kind of light grey stone.
And this is what it is.
I must say, there's a mistake in the announcement here.
This comes from the Mousterian Period, but the date is about 50,000.
There's a mistake in the numbers here, we'll have to correct that .
.
later.
Well, I'm afraid I've given you a bit of a clue, Rick.
Had you not said anything, - Dr Rainey, I would've said it was of the Mousterian Period.
- Good! - That's very easy for you, Rick.
That's not really the problem.
- No.
The location of this is the real problem.
Well, a geological problem, isn't it? You a geologist, Glyn? - No, but Geoffrey is.
- Anyway, it's a good deal older than you said.
Older than your 50,000 years.
I don't think I've really given much away here, because it's the location that really is the problem on this one.
- Is made of quartzite, is it? - Yes, yes, yes.
- So it doesn't come from England? - I shouldn't think so.
- It's a very cruel instrument.
- Could it come from India? - Couldn't come from any of the - It might.
It might.
But I wouldn't swear to it at all.
- It's a cruel, sort of chopping - Chopping tool.
It might be older than Mousterian, actually.
It might come from India or Africa.
It's an extremely crude thing, just made out of a quartzite pebble, they've just knocked one end of it about.
I don't think it comes from India.
We have a good many in the museum which are supposed to come from the stone of India and they are generally much more deeply stained than this.
That's not infallible.
The thing of Indochina, the things that are called chopping tools? Well, I'm not into Yes, it's a chopping chopper.
Are you thinking of the zone of West India.
Yes, north-west India, yes.
I don't think it's that, but it's an extremely crude thing made of a quartzite pebble.
- If it is an artefact, is it - If it is an artefact.
But I wonder, if it is something larger, a large pebble that has broken.
There is very clear flaking.
But that's the quartzite.
- I wouldn't guarantee that it is made by man.
- You wouldn't? - I wouldn't guarantee.
- Would you locate it, Rick? No, it's a matter of geology, and I don't profess to be a geologist.
Not the type, at all? It's like those chopper chopping tools of the Stone period.
It might be 250,000 years old, more like that, easily.
It might also be a large natural pebble which has been broken in half.
Do you like South East Asia for the location? You won't commit yourself? - I won't commit myself.
- How about you, Glyn? I won't commit myself.
It might be there.
Well, I can see I didn't give anything away on this one! You see, actually, it comes from Creswell, the Creswell Caves in Derbyshire and there was a mistake in the announcement.
Is there much Mousterian there? Well, it's called Mousterian, the Manchester Museum, 50,000 to 100,000 years old.
Dug up by Boyd Dawkins at the Creswell Caves.
I wouldn't put many shirts on that.
You wouldn't? You wouldn't agree with that? Oh, I don't think so, on the whole.
I hate to be very severe in scoring this one, but I can't really give you any score at all.
You won't argue with that, will you? Let's move along to our next one.
I think this is the time that I should turn back to Glyn Daniel, with great pleasure.
Now, viewers may be amused to know that Well, I mean, it's for sharpening and something was kept in here, it must be a knife rack, mustn't it? - For a knife, an axe? - An axe? Several knives? Thrust in here, you sharpen them? - Sgian dubh? - Little pieces in there.
That's a piece of curatorial work.
It looks like some of these things you find in the open-air museum in Stockholm, where they have the houses in the open-air museum, you know? - You think so? - I think so.
The wood isn't dried out.
It's modern.
Yes, but the wood isn't dry.
It's Southern.
- I should have thought so.
Yes.
- It's tropical wood.
That's the wrong lead there, I'm sure.
It's far more like some of the Dao sheaths that you get in Assam.
It's not far from there.
It may not be Assam, and maybe Burma, something like that.
- Could you explain what you mean by that? - A Dao? A Dao is a sort of, a kind of axe.
And they put the head of it here.
And did you say where it was found? Well, they're very You get things very like this in Assam.
And maybe a bit further south, I'm not sure.
- Those chaps who don't wear shoes.
The Nagas use them.
- The Nagas, yes.
- What you think, Dr Rainey? - Well, the design It could be from that area all right.
There's crosshatching.
And certainly the wood is all right.
You got split bamboo here, isn't it? I wouldn't I certainly couldn't argue with that.
There it is.
Which is a grey-black in colour.
This is what it is.
And now, Geoffrey, is this in your line? - Looks like part of a roller skate, doesn't it? - Very much, yes.
- Part of a roller skate.
- Not seriously, Daniel.
It's stone, to begin with.
Yes, it's made of stone and it's got a small hole through it.
Um It could be a spindle whorl.
It's rather heavy for that.
But it hasn't much wear around the rim, so I think probably on the whole, that's what it is.
But where it comes from, I'd hate to say.
- Do you not think it's a loom weight? - I should doubt that.
- It's too symmetrical for that.
- I don't think it's heavy enough.
- It's kind of an non-descript thing.
- It's a non-descript thing, yes.
If it's a spindle, then there should be a hole through here for the shaft.
Well, it could be, I suppose a loom weight, but I don't know why, and anyway it could be much more practical for that case.
- I'm afraid this is beyond me.
Rick? - We have got to so far? It's loom weight or a spindle whorl made of stone.
I think is definitely a spindle whorl.
Put it on a spindle like a flywheel, this pencil isn't big enough but turn it round and give impetus to the spindle, when you have the thread.
It could be from anywhere.
The south-west of America If it's from this country, it's probably about 2000 years old.
Plus and minus, I don't know.
- What is it made of? - I thought you were going to ask that.
Do you mind if I cut a slice off it? Yes, you can, but I'm sure the museum doesn't want you to.
- I willaccept the date of 2000.
- Where is the museum curator? Is he looking? Could you look at the edge.
You haven't looked at the edge.
- Which edge? - The outside edge.
- Yes.
- Is it a circular thing? No.
Oh.
It's I mustn't do that.
- No.
- That would be the end.
Couldn't be a clubhead.
- It's a fossilised something.
- Ah! Now we're getting somewhere.
- Shell? - No, it's not a shell.
Wait a minute.
It's very heavy.
It isn't like an ordinary stone, it's a spindle whorl Made out of something.
I've accepted that it's a spindle whorl, I've accepted that it's 2000 years ago, which it take to be a general date for the early Iron Age.
Something of that kind.
But what is made of? You said at first it was made of stone, - and that may possibly be legally correct.
- Fossilised - Not a shell, but a worm of some sort, isn't it? - No! It's a vertebra of something.
- It is, it is.
- It's a fossil vertebra.
Yes, it's the fossilised vertebra of an Ichthyosaurus and we are going to end this programme by having an Ichthyosaurus for you to see.
I'll give the panel three more marks and see, that has brought us up to 14, but it hasn't really brought us within measurable distance of 20.
Here is the old Ichthyosaurus, and we end our programme with this fossilised vertebrae and this charming person leering at the panel.
Well, now, that's the end of the programme tonight.
With my assistance, the panel have lost.
In a programme in a fortnight's time, the challengers will be at the Sheffield Museum and the panel will consist of Adrian Digby, of Hugh Short, and of Edward Wenham, who was formerly editor of The Connoisseur.
Until then, with our thanks again to Dr Rainey and the rest of the panel, good night.