Louis Theroux's Weird Weekends (1998) s03e03 Episode Script

1 You don't want me to rule those two Boer republics as the sole property of the Boer people.
- Can I make a distinction - No, no, no.
No! No, you asked me the question and I answer it.
No! South Africa - a vibrant multiracial democracy, a model of reconciliation and opportunity on the African continent.
But I was here for a different story.
I'd heard about a subculture of separatists, intensely opposed to the new regime, and determined to build its own communities for whites only.
My first stop - Owendale, a town on the edges of the Karoo Desert, founded by Pieter du Toit.
He devised an unusual security system to protect its exclusively white inhabitants.
So where are we? Why are we here? We are right in the middle of our security strip that runs right around our little town, with game animals for the protection.
We've got the black wildebeest over there.
You mean this is like a strip running round the community of Owendale, in order to defend against outsiders? - That's right.
- Using wild animals? - Yah.
- 0f different degrees of ferocity.
- Yah.
- Featuring, among others, wildebeest? Yah, black wildebeest.
- Black wildebeest.
- Ostriches.
- Ostriches? - Yah.
The birds? Are they dangerous? - Yes.
One ostrich kick can kill you.
- Really? Would it be 0K for me to put that to the test? - You can try it, but at your own risk.
- 0K.
Now, what do I do if it starts coming towards me? It's the ostriches you've got to watch out for? - Not here.
They're not here at the moment.
- How much danger am I in right now? Not much.
You're too close to a vehicle.
- What about now? - You're safe.
If you walk towards them, they'll run.
So what you're saying, in effect, is I'm a more powerful security deterrent than they are? Yes, at this stage.
Yes.
It's like a real-life Jurassic Park.
But without the dinosaurs.
I hooked up with Pieter's wife, Minkie, to find out more.
So this is Owendale.
- This is Owendale.
- A community you and your husband founded.
Yeah, you can say that.
Yeah.
And what's special about it? Special about it is the fact that we are only white people staying in the town.
Only white people are allowed to buy in the town.
But I saw a black gentleman on his way out just now.
That's right.
They're working for us.
But they are not allowed to stay in the town.
We, as white people, aren't supposed to be ruled by blacks.
Now, from the way we look at it, you see, you're not ruled by blacks.
It's basically a multiracial government.
And second, what would be the problem with having blacks in the government anyway? Just the fact that because of our religion it's not meant to be that way.
God created not even animal as equal.
If you look at nature, nothing in the nature is equal.
Basically, what it boils down to is he sees those that are chose.
- And who did he choose? - The white people.
So where does that leave non-whites? Well, the way we see it, they've got no chance.
What about if you're like one sixteenth non-white? - No.
- 0ne thirty-second? - 0ne sixty-fourth? - That's basically what it all boils down to.
God doesn't want us to mix, and that's why we stay apart from the blacks.
You make it sound almost as though we're a different species.
Could be.
Very possible.
Minkie wanted to show me how her dream of a whites-only town was progressing, so she took me on a tour.
In the town at the moment, there is 15 houses, 15 families.
Most of the houses are three, four-bedroom houses.
We will try and keep everything white.
- This is the dressing room.
- You have a dressing room? Closets galore! - There's the badminton - Badminton court? court, as well.
- Yeah.
This is going to be the library.
Not much in there at the moment.
- This is the swimming pool.
- There's a black person out there, working.
- Would he be allowed to swim in here? - No, he's not allowed.
That's mixing socially, and that's what we're trying to keep away from.
And this is my favourite spot in town.
- Have you been on this? - I've been on this.
Later on in the afternoon you can't touch this.
- Why? - It's too hot, because of the sun.
- Not because it's black? - No, because it's too hot.
You've got a sense of humour about your beliefs.
- 0h, yes, definitely.
- Do they seem at all weird to you? No.
Sometimes they do weird things, but they don't seem at all weird.
- Who? - The blacks.
- 0h, no, I meant your beliefs.
- 0h, my beliefs? - No.
No, they don't seem weird to me.
- Yeah.
I don't think I would have believed it if it was weird.
- Yeah.
- It might be weird to other people.
Do you mind being thought of as a racist? Erm Not really, but I wouldn't go and introduce myself as one.
Yeah.
Do you think it's weird that we believe in the stuff that we do? Quite honestly, it's very unusual.
I listen to black music.
- I like a couple of Michael Jackson's - Do you? - I'm a big Lionel Richie fan.
- Really? - Yes, definitely.
Erm - That seems very unusual, though.
- You respect them for what they are.
- Lionel Richie couldn't come in your home? - No, he couldn't come in my home.
- Except it was in vinyl form or CD form.
I enjoy his music.
Don't you think Lionel Richie would be upset if he saw you saying things about you know? - I hope you're not going to show it to him.
- Why do you hope not? He could see this.
He could see this? Then hopefully he'll respect me for my views.
- Do you really think that's likely? - Erm It could be.
- I'm sort of making up the words.
- Some of them sound right.
Something like that.
Things deteriorated when I found Pieter's record collection.
- That's Whitney Houston.
- Whitney Houston.
Presumably Whitney Houston is incapable of being saved, as a black woman.
Right? Why are you laughing at that, Pieter? I'd always thought of music as kind of a as a way to get over barriers, especially racial boundaries, and a way in which different races can come together, and different cultures.
Because we all like pop music, don't we? We all like Chuck Berry and Whitney Houston.
Nowadays I'm more into classical stuff.
Classical stuff like The Temptations? 0h.
That's very old.
20 years ago you were grooving to the sounds of The Temptations, - and Herbie Mann, rhythm and blues.
- Yes.
And now here you are, in a community that's basically established to I still listen to I can still listen to music made by a black man.
If it's nice music, why can't I listen? You honestly don't see any contradiction between listening to rhythm and blues music and enjoying music created by people you wouldn't let into your home? No.
This whole thing has been turned around now.
This is becoming now You're trying to turn this into a political thing.
That's what you're trying to do now.
You can't carry on.
Switch it off, I'm not talking.
Wonders! Well, I wasn't off to a very good start, but I had another lead.
I'd heard about a group claiming land, not because they were white, but as an endangered minority people - the Boers.
How much the idea of Boer nationalism crossed racial boundaries was something I wanted to find out from Boer State Party leader and swimming pool repair man - Dirk Van Tonder.
Is that you? - That's me, yes.
I'm Louis.
Louis Theroux.
How's it going? - Well, fine, fine.
- Yeah.
What is the Boer State Party? What does the Party stand for? The Boer State Party stands for the reinstatement of the Boer states, period.
So does that basically mean a separate country for Boer people, for the Boers? Yes.
Yes, that means the reinstatement of the Boer states as it was in 1899.
Because the English came and they took it from us.
Yeah.
And is that it? Is that basically all the land? It is quite a big chunk.
It's a big chunk.
I don't want you to take this the wrong way, but I'm picking up a teeny bit of hostility towards the English.
Well, I'm glad you say it's only a teeny bit.
- I can elaborate on that, but - Is that true? Is that fair to say? There's no great love among Boer people for the English.
No, there's no great love.
No.
So what will your new country look like? What will it be like? - Well, you're basically in it now.
- Are Boers in a majority here at the moment? No, we are not the majority at the moment.
But let's look at Israel.
At one stage, Israeli people was a very small minority.
And we're basically in a similar situation now.
We mustn't despair on that.
Dirk invited me to a Boer State Party festival the following day.
Do you think it might be advisable to have a little speech to smooth the way a little bit? - And maybe do it in Afrikaans? - That'll be wonderful.
- If you tell me what you'd like to convey - Yeah.
I'm here to learn.
Ek is hier om te leer.
I'll write that down for you.
Ek is I am.
Ek is.
Hier.
Here.
- To learn.
- Om te leer.
What's happening tomorrow? Are we expecting any special guests, any dignitaries? Well, Mr Terreblanche is going to be the main pivot of it.
- Mr Terreblanche? - Mr Terreblanche.
He is the leader of the AWB.
If you look into his blowtorch blue eyes, you can see in him the spirit of the Boer.
- Thank you for having me.
- Vir dankie.
Buy a donkey? You're not winding me up about that? It really is, "Buy a donkey"? The day of the party.
I'd arrived early to meet the future citizens of an independent Boer nation.
Erm I sense these people are wearing costumes.
- Yes.
- Is this a traditional Boer costume? The Afrikaner, as such, did not have folk dancing, as such.
Even though there was a rich heritage amongst the Europeans of folk dancing.
- And it started it off that way.
- Really? So in a sense, it's a manufactured tradition? - Yes, just don't say it! - Dirk doesn't like that.
I don't like that message.
If you look at the old Boer leaders and the way they dressed, you'd see a lot in the fashion, the scarf and the jacket and that.
- And the dancing, though? - There's a cultural link there.
Dirk had a lot of organising to do, so I decided to circulate.
- You must speak English.
This is the BBC.
- How do you do? He is with the Boerestaat Party, and he's one of our very staunch stalwarts and he's been around a long time.
- A very good man.
- What's his background? His background? Let him tell you himself what his background is.
- I think he was with the Luftwaffe.
- Was he? - He was with the Luftwaffe.
- Yes, for many years.
What does it help to talk about which was in the past, huh? - People don't believe you.
- Like what? 0h, if we speak about National Socialism, they think you are stupid.
The best time in the world that we have had in Germany.
- Really? - 0h, yes.
If you don't like, well, I don't care.
Yeah, yeah.
Well, no, that's not the Fred, what would be your perspective on that? That's not where we're coming from, but we're here to learn.
I don't know.
I wasn't in the Luftwaffe, so I wouldn't know.
Do you both, you, Fred, and you, Herr Beisner, support the idea of a separate Boerestaat, Boer nation? - Yes.
- That's the only solution.
As I said before, if you don't draw boundaries now, history is going to draw them for you.
- And Dirk Dirk has - Excuse me, young man.
I don't like any provocation here.
I don't like any talk of this.
- Will you excuse me? - Thank you very much, Herr Beisner.
No, not me! - Yes.
No - Did I say something wrong? Well, he's one of the old Luftwaffe.
He's still very He likes to Something went wrong, but I don't know what.
- He probably doesn't like the British! - Really? - I don't know.
- You think he doesn't like the British? Is he basically a National Socialist? - Yes.
0h, yes.
- AKA Nazi? - He was in the Luftwaffe.
- Yeah.
But some people in the Luftwaffe weren't enthusiastic Nazis.
- He seemed totally unreconstructed.
- I don't know.
It was before my time.
- But that's - 0h That's unusual.
- I have spoken to the leader.
- Mr Terreblanche? Yes.
And sad news, he will not be able to make it today.
- 0h, too bad.
- So that's sad for us today.
We were expecting three or four hundred and so far it's What would you say? - Fifty? - Maybe more.
I don't know.
- But it's early days.
- We'll see.
But nevertheless, we carry on with our programme and we'll see.
The rest will maybe come later.
Now that Mr Terreblanche had cancelled, Herr Beisner, the National Socialist, took over as key speaker.
For the first time in my life, I was second billing to a Nazi.
Hello.
My naam is Louis Theroux van BBC.
Ek is hier om te leer van die Boer kultuur.
Vir dankie.
That went off very well, yes.
They accepted you very well.
The guy before me appeared to be speaking in German.
Yes, you see, he's from the AWB.
And I can't speak on his behalf, we did give him a platform.
So what's his deal? Cos I couldn't understand any of it.
- He is an officer in the AWB.
- Right.
- But he is also a veteran of - 0f the German Second World War.
Second World War, yes.
And that's why, maybe, he's with the AWB and not with us.
Yeah, it sounds like you're distancing yourself from him.
But I didn't understand a single thing he said.
I don't know what he said.
What did he say? At one point, he made a bit of a racial comment, where he said everything in this country was the achievement of the white man.
We in the Boerestaat tend to differ a little with that.
We The essence of our nationhood falls on the term "Boer", first and foremost.
- Yeah.
- And then on skin colours and whatever.
Since we've had a little bit of a rapport and we've got to know each other a little bit, man to man, I don't reckon it does you any favours to give people like that a platform if that's the kind of thing he's saying.
Yes.
We try to be as accommodating as possible.
So basically, you can't risk alienating that constituency.
I think they're going to start now.
You'd better not miss this.
I was puzzled why a nice guy like Dirk was clinging to a dream of an independent state, instead of participating in the multiracial South Africa, especially if this was the seedbed of that separate Boer nation.
Against my better instincts, I couldn't help feeling slightly sorry for Dirk.
So, looking around, this is the event in full flood.
You expected maybe 400, but there's only about I would say this is a quarter of the event that we'd have hoped for.
If we're looking at this weather, it's self explanatory.
And also other events, Mr Terreblanche's emergency meeting.
- Yeah.
- It also comes into play.
But like I said You don't think it shows a sign of people losing faith in the idea of an independent Boer nation? 0h, no, not at all.
I think the way we're doing it here is people are loving it and they like to be here.
- They stick around, even in this weather.
- Yeah, it's about to rain.
I left, disappointed that Mr Terreblanche hadn't shown.
But Dirk said he'd try to set up a meeting.
I wasn't clear what it was about the new South Africa that people like Dirk didn't like.
To find out, I'd come to a training camp for Boers, led by former nurse, Fritz Meier.
- Pleased to meet you.
- Pleased to meet you, too.
- Welcome to our academy.
- Thank you very much.
0h, that's a firm handshake.
The following day, the cadets were graduating.
Fritz had invited me to Join their final day of training.
They do know that the Anglo-Boer war is over? Well, you must ask your Queen to apologise.
I think that would be the decent thing to do.
- Queen Elizabeth? Yeah, I'll - Tell her to just say, "I'm sorry".
- I'll give her a call this evening.
- Will you? 0K, good.
Because they are discriminated against, our people can't get work.
They just can't get work.
Once they've finished training, we put them on a farm.
Security is one of the responsibilities.
0K, three burglars on your doorstep, sir.
Sort them out.
0h, not very good! Aggressive! - Dead! Cock.
Quickly, there's another one! - Another one? Cock again.
Cock! No 0h, poo! - Good.
Your aim is superb.
- Thank you.
- Nothing wrong with your aim.
- I've got to speed up.
But you won't survive in Africa.
They come too fast.
Who is the enemy? The people that are killing the commercial farmers, once a week.
If the Boer people wants to survive in South Africa, then we will have to be able to defend ourselves.
And, erm Otherwise we're sitting ducks.
Like the white people in the rest of Africa, they fled.
There's nobody left.
Uh! 0h, my God! - Is this your first time? - Yeah.
- Ever? - Yeah.
Horsemanship, is that an important Boer quality? - I think so.
- Good horsemen? Mr Terreblanche? I don't want to talk about another Afrikaner.
We should love each other.
But I think he's done our cause a lot of harm.
Really? To the international community, he represents the Boer cause.
- Did you know that? - That's a pity.
That's a pity, because it does our cause, our just cause, a lot of wrong.
Erm But let's go and talk while we have a look at the countryside.
I wish that the Boer people had a leader like Nelson Mandela.
He fought the cause of his people till the bitter end, and I respect him for that.
- How am I doing? - All right, all right.
0h, that's better.
Now, something is happening.
When I see this, I see our freedom on the horizon.
Five the next morning.
Just a few hours to prove myself.
Come on, Louis.
We're waiting for you.
So what happens now, after the graduation, the passing out? What do you do then? The Boer folk have to go and work on the farms, so we can get the blacks from the farm, so that we can be more white in our in our country.
- Less blacks.
- What do you think about the Boer republic? It's our land.
Africa's our land.
And now they took it from us.
And we have to take it back.
I was beginning to get the sense that for the academy, defending white farmers could sometimes mean evicting black tenants.
I reverted to the role of spectator for the passing out parade.
Before I left, Fritz wanted to show me the site of a British-run concentration camp.
How important is this place in Boer culture? The fact of the camps during the Boer War? Well, I think it's part of our history and as such, it's respected by us.
And Boers don't really trust the British as a result, no? Well, I think, erm it did a lot to harm good relationships.
- Yeah.
- Although it's in the past, we think that the wars against the Boers are still continuing.
As I said, you're not part of my people.
I will be sad if my daughter marries you, because there's too big a culture difference.
What would you have done if I'd come and I'd been black? - It wouldn't have worked.
- Do you just see the skin? We, as Afrikaner people, are being killed, and being trampled upon and being discriminated against because we are white.
Because of that, a lot of potential good relations between white and black people are being destroyed.
I don't see why the Boer have to be separate from the new democratic South Africa.
The only proven successful way of reducing that tension is by separate development.
I was about to say goodbye when our cameraman, also a South African Boer, decided to step in.
act like a fascist.
- I'm not a fascist.
I'm not a fascist.
I'm a loving father of my family and I want peace and I want law and order, and I want first world standards.
I'm not a fascist.
No, I'm a bitter-ender and you're a joiner.
- Because I've joined the new South Africa? - That's right.
- Why? - He's a traitor.
I was discouraged.
I was hoping my next contact would offer some hope.
A former follower of Mr Terreblanche, he'd had a change of heart, and now Eddie Van Maltitz was participating in the new South Africa.
- Is this Louis? - Are you Eddie? I'm Eddie, Louis.
Pleased to meet you.
Welcome.
- You nearly said you were Louis.
- That's 0K.
- How's it going? - Nice, man.
Welcome.
- This is my daughter, Marti.
- Marti, I'm Louis.
How do you do? - Did you have a good trip? - Yeah.
- Nice, man.
- Yeah, thank you very much.
I keep on running out of time.
I've got an appointment at the communal barbecue place.
The communal barbeque place is where quite a few people come.
I'm usually the only white man that eats there.
- They all say hello.
- Hello, everyone.
- What language are you speaking? - Sosutu.
- Sosutu.
- This is a Sosutu area.
Most Boers don't know how to speak the language, where I do.
And they just need leading and guidance.
I'm Louis.
Nice to meet you.
Do the family have to wear khakis? Is that in the rules? - That is military.
- That's military? - Because we're in a war situation.
- Marti's not wearing them.
- Alan will soon wear them as well.
And Marti.
- Yep.
0f course, yes.
- Where this film going to? - BBC2 in Britain.
- BBC? 0n TV? - Yeah.
0h, 0K.
You know, I am trying to sell Africa to the world.
I love this continent.
And Africa needs to come right.
I'm a racist.
I believe you mustn't mix black and white kids in the same school.
- Really? - We're gonna talk straight.
I firmly believe it.
- They know you're a racist? - Yeah, for sure.
For sure! Eddie, if you, by your own assessment, are a racist, then what are you doing here, breaking bread with black people? Because he's a racist, as well.
- The black man is a worse racist than I am.
- Really? Believe it! What do you think happened in Rwanda and Burundi? - Yeah.
- Eh? Can I tell you? They did it to their own brothers.
The Boers never done it.
Wait.
You English did it more than the worst.
You English killed more black aborigines in Australia than the Boers ever did.
But we are the polecats of the world.
That's not right, Louis.
We are here for Africa! The British colonists just pulled out and left a vacuum, and we Boers said, "No, we're not leaving.
" And we, especially the right wing, are staying for a cause.
And that cause is to improve the level of society.
What were you saying, Eddie? Can we get a translation? 0K, I'll tell you.
I said that you are my guest.
They must give you real nice, tasty food.
I will totally accept if I am allowed to stay in a multiracial society.
But then in that multiracial society, I must have my own culture.
I must be guaranteed my language.
I must be guaranteed my prosperity.
- How are you? - I'm fine.
- Louis.
- Amos.
- Amos.
Nice to meet you.
From? - Springs.
- Springs.
- I am a taxi driver.
Taxi driver? Yeah.
I want to be Lawrence of Africa, not Lawrence of Arabia.
I'd love, when I die, that people say the guy tried.
I'm not a wealthy man, but you know what? I've got it all in here.
It's not what you have, it's what you are.
Yes! You know? Eddie invited me back to his farm.
So far, I liked him.
And if he was a racist, he was unlike any racist I'd ever met before.
- What are we looking at? - This is a pothole.
As a right-winger or as a Boer I do not like this, cos my name's at stake.
And I feel bad about it.
I mean, you look at this, Louis, just look at the state of this road.
It's already been patched profusely.
My brother, this is going to cause accidents.
That's one of the first signs of a banana republic.
Do you know that? Is that why you? Look, look, Eddie, look.
It's not that big.
0h, it's not that big, but it has been repaired over and over.
- Has that got your goat? - Yes, this has really got my goat.
So this pothole is a symbol of everything you stand against? Yes.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
- You look at that and think, is that our future? - That is the future of Africa without the Boer.
- But with you? - With me, I'm going to fix it.
- So is this your farm, Eddie? - This is where we farm.
So you are a true Boer, cos Boer means farmer, doesn't it? Farmer, that's right, the Boers.
- This is my son, Michael.
Louis.
- Hi, Michael.
How's it going? He's wearing those Afrikaner shorts.
We don't wear them that high up in Britain.
- Why does he wear his shorts so high up? - We like it.
We like it, cos when you kick I also wear shorts like that.
Really? Urgh! It weighs a ton! I've got it.
Sorry, Louis, join the club.
I like you.
I like you, Louis.
Don't break your neck, Louis.
You seem to have camouflage on your roof.
It is just a symbol.
That's Eddie's symbol, who loves camouflage.
Eddie wanted to train me in armed combat, to help him on his farm patrols.
We'll just grab the weapons.
You have sandbags here, right in your house.
Why would you need that? - And look at this.
What is this? - Hey! That is That is for farm attack when you are going into an area.
A shield? It turned out Eddie had a secret weapon for his farm patrol, 14-year-old Marti.
- That was good.
That was good, Marti.
- Thank you.
- Why are you learning that? - Self-defence.
- Self-defence? Really? - That's what farm watch is about.
Is that what this is, farm watch? - It's about defending farms against criminals? - Yes.
- It's got to go backward, over the head.
- 0w! - Mind over matter.
- 0w! - What if I just came at you like that? - You do this.
Block, and stab in the stomach.
Block, kick, strike and back.
This is Africa.
Survival of the fittest.
Will Marti be coming on the patrol with us? I'd feel a lot safer if she did.
Yes, yes.
0K, stop.
Thank you.
Am I going to be much use on this patrol? Hmm, you'll be good for cannon fodder.
I'll put you in front when they start shooting.
- You used to be with the Terreblanches? - I used to be.
I resigned ten years ago.
- He woke up my patriotism in my life.
- Did he? Yes.
I was just an ordinary guy, making money, not worrying about anything else.
So why did you leave Terreblanche's organisation? - Lack of discipline.
- What? Lack of your discipline? Lack of their discipline.
It's ridiculous.
You can't go smoking, drinking and beating people up.
You have to make a plan.
- Come, my friend.
- Should I wear that? It weighs 17 kilograms.
It can withstand any bullet.
Fetch my gun, Marti.
I want to shoot at him.
Bring the R1.
It won't go through.
Ready to hold on? I'll just shoot you in the stomach.
- 0K? - Yeah, ready.
- There have been lots of farm attacks.
- Are we going to be all right? I think so.
We are on farm patrol, going from farm to farm, making sure that the most important human resource stays alive.
It's an endangered species.
The farmer.
- Is it just about protecting white people? - No, black people, as well.
Do not forget, they feel terribly unsafe as well.
They're part of the family.
Our black people are our own family.
Do you always take Marti and your daughter along? That's right.
For support.
Now, they don't seem like they'd be the most effective - Marti's trained, but she's only about 14.
- That's right.
- And then your daughter is how old? - She's 23.
23? I mean, are they going to be an effective fighting force? Yes, because they've been trained in modern warfare.
The farms were quiet that night.
Perhaps the criminals were scared off by Eddie's and my mastery of modern warfare.
Meanwhile, word came through that Eddie's former leader, Eugene Terreblanche, was finally ready to meet me.
He had a reputation for a fiery temper, so I was slightly nervous.
On the way, I decided to pick up my old friend Dirk for some advice.
- I've got a CD of his poetry.
- Could we listen to it? - You're welcome to.
- What does it sound like? Music? - No, it's Afrikaans poetry.
- Poetry? And in the background, very gentle music.
- How is your Afrikaans these days? - It's excellent! Yeah, it's superb.
I'm fluent.
But for viewers, unfortunately, I have to speak English.
- Yeah! - Can you put the CD on? - Yes, I can put it on.
- Stick it on.
It's just a long intro at the beginning.
It's a bit like Hotel California.
- Do you like The Eagles? - I do, quite.
Bit of a guilty pleasure.
- I am also a fan of The Eagles.
- Really? Yeah.
But I never could quite get to that Hotel California.
- What are they trying to tell you in the words? - I think it's Isn't it a erm There you go.
What subjects should I avoid when I'm talking to Mr Terreblanche? Racism.
That's a good one.
Because he's not, in my eyes, a racist.
- Yeah.
Really? - He's a nationalist.
He's a Boer nationalist.
Why, what happens if you bring up racism? How do you sum this up? It's fair enough to be respectful of your cultural heritage, to be interested in being a Boer, but I don't understand why you couldn't pursue that in the context of a multiracial South Africa, why you have to have your own country to do that.
- So, Louis, where did you get that shirt from? - This? My girlfriend got it for me.
- It's got farmers on it.
- Your girlfriend? - Yeah.
- 0h.
- Do you like it? - I'm not I'm not mad about it, no.
Really? 0h, dear.
0h, dear, dear, dear.
As long as Mr TB, Mr Terreblanche likes it, that's the important thing.
- ET, you say.
- ET? Sounds a bit funny! You say Mr Terreblanche.
ET! Erm I'm just kidding.
How do you do? Pleased to meet you.
Thanks so much for agreeing to come on our show.
- Much appreciated.
- Thank you.
- Seriously.
- I hope you appreciate it, my friend.
I do.
Seriously.
0K, I start for you.
Yeah.
Well, I've been enjoying your CD very much.
Ah, yes? Did you understand it? Well, Dirk was kind enough to translate some of the words.
- Yes? - Yeah.
- So, yeah, that was very very good.
- Thank you.
I understand there's been historical animosity between the British and the Boers.
But I'm hoping that in a spirit of reconciliation we can achieve some kind of understanding.
I'm not sure what that would be.
I mean, how would you feel about that? That is the Cape Province.
I'm claiming and I'm demanding those two republics.
Yeah.
Let me just get a rough sense.
So it includes Johannesburg? Johannesburg is still part of it, but you can have Johannesburg.
- Is that Johannesburg? - Yeah.
0K, I give it to you tonight.
You can have it.
- I don't claim any part of South Africa.
- Well, I am not claiming Johannesburg.
Yeah, 0K.
Why not? Because Johannesburg is the place where the wars started.
Erm There are a majority of black people and people from foreign countries.
- They can have it, with love from me.
- 0K.
So It can be a state in a state.
So what does that leave? - Say again? - What does that leave? This area here? All that is the two republics of the Transvaal and the Orange Free State.
I'll write it neat.
Afrikaans vry staat.
Now, my friend, we can start to talk culture.
Just to make it a little easier to understand, I brought a small chart.
A lot of these qualities are in black people and coloured people, too.
Can a non-white person be a Boer? - Never.
- Never? - Never.
He could never be a Boer.
- What if he has all these qualities? Christian, God fearing, accepts the elements, weather, toughness, pride, patriotism, sense of history, speaks Afrikaans, and he just happens not to be white? It is not a matter of black and white, my friend.
You really do not understand.
- Why? - We are not Africans from Africa.
We are white people, the descendants of the British and the Irish, and the French people and the Dutch people.
- Hmm.
- We are from Europe.
You don't want me to rule those two Boer republics as the sole property of the Boer people.
- Can I make a distinction? - No, no, no, no, no.
No, you asked me the question and I answer it.
No! Definitely no! My task is to defend my people against the ideas to destroy my people.
Thanks for clearing that up.
If I could recap.
Christian, God fearing, accepts the elements, the weather, toughness, pride, patriotism of being a Boer, sense of history, Boer history, ideally should speak Afrikaans.
You worked very hard to come to the last point.
- Must be white.
- Yes, must be white.
If we allow black people or non-white people to become Boer people, then it will be the end of the existence of the Boer people, because in South Africa alone, there are only three and a half million against forty million black people.
There's an exciting new country, a democratic country.
- Exciting? Exciting? - Yes, it seems so.
Why are you saying that? What is exciting? Exciting that the people who build the highways and the schools are not in the government any more? Is that exciting? The downfall Mr Terreblanche, I feel as though you're hectoring me a little bit.
Can we just lower the tone slightly? No! No! You are having the interview with me.
I'll choose the volume of the tone! Do you understand me? - Yes.
- 0K, then you accept it.
And if you don't want to have your interview, take your cameras and go.
0K, understood.
I'm not in court and you're not cross-questioning me, 0K? - No, I understand that.
- 0K.
- No, I just - Don't try to be cocky, my friend.
I'm not trying to be cocky.
I'm really trying to establish some kind of dialogue.
You take another tone, my friend, and never tell me I must reduce my volume.
I'm a Boer, and I don't need you or your publicity, my friend.
- Mmm.
- All right? I think it's obvious that we're not going to agree about everything.
I would say, though, that erm I sense that you moderated somewhat in your beliefs, because years ago it seemed you were talking about armed struggle and predicted a civil war.
But I predicted that there will be a revolution between black nations in South Africa.
So what does the AWB, your organisation, do at that point? Well, we will defend ourselves.
- We will not allow those forces to - Do you grab your land? Do you grab this area of the Transvaal and the 0range Free State? Listen, I am not grabbing anything.
I am entitled to my country.
- That's what I meant.
Sorry.
- No.
No.
You asked me what I will do and then you decide to ask me if I will grab.
Put off that camera, my friend.
Can I just shake hands and say thank you very much You have a firm handshake.
0w! That hurts.
Why are you squeezing it so hard? - Am I not a man? - Yeah.
Meaning? Am I not a man? Is that Shakespeare? I left Mr Terreblanche with the feeling that he'd never see his dream of a whites-only homeland.
And there was something rather sad about how out of touch he was with the country around him.
My time in South Africa was drawing to a close.
But before I left, I went to see Eddie Van Maltitz on his farm.
I've finished milking the cows them volkers in Jo'burg are eating.
I can't believe He'd invited me to an annual Boer ceremony.
Welcome home.
But before we left, there was work to do.
Well, you seem very friendly, of course, but some of the people I've met haven't been, and have been really hostile in some ways, or deeply I don't know, not interested in building a future for black and white.
Just for white.
Well, can I tell you? I go down this point of view.
If you play the piano, you mustn't just play the white ones.
- Play the black ones, you get a perfect tune.
- Do you believe that? Ebony and ivory? Yes, I do believe that.
But do not forget, they're still separate.
- They are not - They're all on the same keyboard.
Yes, but you don't get them camouflaged, though.
Cos black ones and white ones play, and it does a beautiful tune.
- Thank you, man.
- Yeah, Mr Terreblanche, very hostile.
- I think because - Deeply racist.
Yes, I think because he has lost a dream and it's hurt him terribly.
- What dream? - A dream that the Boers would rule.
- Yeah.
- You know? 0K, up.
0ne Come, Englishman.
Thank you.
- Appreciate that.
You'd be a good farmer.
- Yeah.
- You'd be a good Boer.
- Haven't you lost that dream, too, then? I believe that the Boer is indispensable to Africa.
Most white people agree with you, they want to make it work in the new South Africa? If they didn't want to, they'd have gone.
They're here to stay.
You've got to be optimistic in this world.
Enthusiasm breaks through any barrier.
But you must be enthusiastic.
You must take the bull by the horns.
We'll do it, as God predicts.
Prove that you feed the nation.
Don't say you love people.
Show it that you love them.
Push, you guys.
Push, push, push, push! Push, push, push, push, push! The event Eddie had invited me to was a commemoration of a Boer victory over the Zulus.
- Have you forced Marti to wear camouflage? - Marti, were you forced to? No.
I woke up this morning and asked if he had anything for me to wear.
I said, "I want to wear camo!" When you land up in a fight, you never know when it is.
You're gonna just appear in the bush.
0f course you've got to be camo'ed.
Do you think there's a chance of a fight happening today, then? - No.
- You never know, though? Yes, but I don't think so.
Camouflage clothes has a dominating effect.
Does it? Camouflage clothes has a dominating effect? Yes.
If you come with pink shirts and yellow pants and pink shoelaces, my friend, everybody thinks you're a flower child.
Why make love? Why make war? Let's all make love.
Yeah, yeah.
How are we doing for time? I don't want to miss Look, we've only got three minutes.
Not surprisingly, the proceedings were in Afrikaans, and of all the Boer cultural events I'd been to so far, this was definitely not one of the highlights.
- That was pretty long.
- But it was good.
- Was that good? - I really liked it.
I couldn't really understand what was going on.
Where are you going? Eddie! Here we go.
Here's the rest of the team.
How do you do? - What's your name? - André.
We don't want to mix with the other people.
- That's why we fought the British.
- It's all about domination.
- Yeah.
- Dominating powers.
It's also, do not forget, the new world order says we must make a mulatto, bastard nation.
When you think about the mulatto nation, Eddie, your ancestors are German, I think.
And we met Eugene Terreblanche, his ancestors are French.
- Yeah, French and Scottish.
- In a way, the Boers are a rainbow nation.
No, they're not a rainbow nation, because they're from the Western civilisations.
- Caucasian.
- Especially white Caucasian.
You can go back to the certain countries they came from.
I don't want this to sound insensitive, but that sounds a little bit Nazi-ish.
Do you realise something? If you want to civilise, you must have some onderskei.
- Eddie, what is "onderskei" in engels? - Differentiate.
If you want to be civilised, you must differentiate.
Discriminate, also.
Do you know, you discriminate? - You like blue more than black.
- Yes, he prefers the English to the Boers.
I can tell you that now.
I know he discriminates, totally! If you can't discriminate, you can't be civilised.
What do you think? You see, this kind of André's coming out with views that in Britain wouldn't be considered civilised or acceptable.
- Well, unfortunately - Like what? What wouldn't be? The idea that racial mixing is somehow wrong or So you don't think it's wrong? - You don't think it's wrong? - What? - Racial mixing.
Do you think it's wrong? - No.
- No? Not? - No.
We are normal people, but we are honest about what we like and what we don't like.
If you are in Britain, and you talk about French people or German people, there's a difference, 0K? If you are in South Africa, and you talk about white and black people, there's much more a difference.
- We've got to shove off, haven't we? - Cheers, my friend.
See you later.
- Quite radical.
- Yes.
He is a military intelligence officer, like I was, or I am still.
Yeah.
He said he erm He told me he was in the jewellery business.
- Yes, that's right.
- Not military intelligence.
No, he is No, all of us.
I'm farming as well, but I'm also in military intelligence.
When people say "Boer", do you think they really mean "white man"? Yes, I think so.
I think so.
Yes.
I only ask because we've gone through this whole thing about the cultural life of the Boer, but it turns out that at the end of the day it seems to be about white and black.
Yes.
I'll believe that.
It was time to say goodbye to Eddie.
He had some strange views on race, but I had to give him this.
He was staying, and in his own way he was doing his bit for the new South Africa.
You can't reconcile and then go banging on about racial differences, like André was.
Integration will come naturally.
Don't force it.
I greet you.
And let me Let we greet each other.
- Hmm.
- Good.
It was before the battle of the, erm when they fought against the guerrillas.
Because maybe I will never see you again.
But if we see each other again, then we'll laugh about this meeting, and say goodbye.
- Thanks very much for your time.
- 0K.
- Yeah.
- May you go well.
- Final thoughts? - I will send a white light to guide you.
A white light to guide me? What does that mean, exactly? - Like a little lamp? - Figure it out for yourself, my friend.
I cannot send you a black light to guide you, because that will not be a light.
- Good night.
- Good night.